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Controversial opinions about Bond films

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  • SoundofthesinnersSoundofthesinners
    Posts: 3,236
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    Soundofthesinners wrote:
    7. Elvis would have been a pretty good henchman without the toupee.

    I think you are the first person I have ever seem defending Elvis which is brave or insane depending on how generous you are feeling. Naturally I'm not feeling generous and I think you are batshit mental.

    Elvis is complete and utter bollocks as a henchman - and that has nothing to do with his syrup.

    Look at this guy: 47730-28123.jpg

    Now look at this guy: 47730-28523.jpg

    The first guy looks like a jackass who couldn't menace a kindergartner. The second looks mildly intimidating, and with something to do could be at least standard henchman material.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,267
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    Soundofthesinners wrote:
    3. Goldfinger and GoldenEye have managed to suffer from overrated/underrated syndrome whereby so many people call a movie overrated that it manages to become underrated

    I'll give you this. GF seems to get a lot of, if not actual hate, then certainly ambivalence given that its the film that guaranteed the series longevity and is packed with great scenes and iconic moments. I'm guilty of it myself sometimes but I think it's important to always respect GF even if it is flawed and not as great as the general publics perception would have you believe l.
    Soundofthesinners wrote:
    7. Elvis would have been a pretty good henchman without the toupee.

    I think you are the first person I have ever seem defending Elvis which is brave or insane depending on how generous you are feeling. Naturally I'm not feeling generous and I think you are batshit mental.

    Elvis is complete and utter bollocks as a henchman - and that has nothing to do with his syrup.

    Well, as I have an upcoming article on The Bondologist Blog entitled:

    “Elvis Has Left The Building…but nobody noticed” – A Defence of Quantum of Solace’s Henchman

    I must be batshit mental, then, Ice. The fact that when I have my hair newly cut I look a bit like Elvis has of course nothing to do with my liking of this offbeat Bond henchman who does...nothing. Ultimately, he exists.

    Hear me out in the article. I may yet change your mind, Ice and any other would-be Elvis detractors.
  • SoundofthesinnersSoundofthesinners
    Posts: 3,236
    ^That will certainly be entertaining.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    edited August 2013 Posts: 18,267
    Soundofthesinners wrote:
    ^That will certainly be entertaining.

    Thank you. I hope you will enjoy it when it appears. You can see the full list of 80 projected blog articles here:

    http://thebondologistblog.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/the-bondologist-blog-revised-topic-list.html
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    Posts: 12,837
    DarthDimi wrote:
    I think Serra's score has to be considered as a part of the film, not as a standalone composition. Its cold, metallic sound fits the film better than either an Arnold score or a Kamen score could have IMO. It plays very well in the background when the tension peaks. I agree that certain tracks, like the car chase with Bond and Xenia, are strangers in the land of Bond music, but on the other hand, I get a warm 90s feeling out of those. The casino music actually comes off as pretty Barry-esque IMO.

    I know that Serra isn't for everyone, but I've never had issues with the music as featured in the film. On CD, it's a bit different. A certain Serra fanship is required for that I suppose. ;-)

    Completely agree. I think Serra's score fits in well with the film, especially during the Russia bits, but on it's own I think it sounds horrible. My least favourite score of the series personally although like I said, I don't mind it when I'm watching the film.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,789
    StirredNotShaken wrote:
    Just gonna re-state one of mine, that LTK has the best ending of any Bond film ever.
    Just going through all the endings in my mind here... LALD had a pretty excellent ending... and I rather like the end of QOS... hmmmm

    I may just have to fully agree with you here though!
    :-?
  • Perilagu_KhanPerilagu_Khan
    Posts: 2,483
    1. DAF is a classic Bond picture.
    2. GF is vastly overrated.
    3. LTK is a top four Bond entry.
    4. Newman's SF score is the best Bond score since GE.
    5. Professor Joe is a great character.
    6. Carley Simon's title track is somewhat overrated.
    7. Sheena Easton's title track is somewhat underrated.
    8. Gun's PTS is the best in series history.
    9. Elliot Carver is the best Bond villain in series history.
    10. Outside of DAD, OP is the lousiest official Bond flick ever made.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,789
    Perilagu_Khan wrote:
    3. LTK is a top four Bond entry.
    Totally disagree here. Top 2.
  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    Posts: 7,314
    1) DN is overrated - I like the film but I think that it pales in comparison to much of what came after it.

    2) The ending of FRWL was ruined - The novel had an incredible ending but the movie played it safe.

    3) NSNA is better than TB - Not by much but overall I find it to be a more enjoyable experience. In particular, the casting of Largo, Domino and Leiter are huge upgrades this time around and Connery gives his best performance since the original TB.

    4) MR is underrated - I'm not saying that it's great but I do think that it entertains more than it disappoints. Also, Michael Lonsdale is great as Drax.

    5) LTK is one of the worst Bond films - There was a time when I was not in the minority with this opinion but apparently that time has passed. Dalton and Davi give good performances but that's the only positive thing that I can say about it.

    6) TWINE is the second best Brosnan film - I find the film to be disappointing but not terrible. It also helps that I don't think too highly of TND and DAD.

    7) QoS is underrated - Sure, it's flawed but I don't see it anywhere near the bottom of my Bond rankings.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,169
    Dragonpol wrote:
    chrisisall wrote:
    Perilagu_Khan wrote:
    9. Elliot Carver is the best Bond villain in series history.

    Wow, talk about off the reservation... are you serious here? Personally, Carver's one of my favourites... maybe even top five or six now that I think on it. :-?

    Yes, Carver was more of a classical Bond villain, wasn't he?

    Yes, he was, wasn't he?

  • Dr_YesDr_Yes
    Posts: 169
    pachazo wrote:
    6) TWINE is the second best Brosnan film - I find the film to be disappointing but not terrible. It also helps that I don't think too highly of TND and DAD.

    I just saw TWINE again yesterday for the first time in several years. I agree with you on this point.
  • RichardoRichardo
    Posts: 135
    Not to milk a dead horse, but:

    Beardless Daniel Craig (#BDC)
    Harris Not Moneypenny (#HNM)
    Judi Dench Flashbacks (#JDF)
  • SPECTREnr1SPECTREnr1
    Posts: 6
    The bomb in GF is the most dated movie bomb ever
  • Dr_YesDr_Yes
    Posts: 169
    Perilagu_Khan wrote:

    3. LTK is a top four Bond entry.
    5. Professor Joe is a great character.

    In my opinion, the mere presence of Professor Joe in LTK keeps the film out of the Top Ten.
  • Dr_YesDr_Yes
    Posts: 169
    Perilagu_Khan wrote:
    10. Outside of DAD, OP is the lousiest official Bond flick ever made.

    This one I tend to agree with although MR comes close to those depths.

  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    SPECTREnr1 wrote:
    The bomb in GF is the most dated movie bomb ever

    Here's a great parody of the atomic bomb in GF from The Naked Gun 2 & 1/2



    Drebin defuses the bomb by tripping over the lead thus pulling the plug out of the socket
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote:
    Just because Connery is the first Bond in history isn't why I find him quintessential. With any character that has multiple actors playing him, each actor has their chance to make the role their own, and make their interpretation legendary. Just because Sean was first doesn't mean George, Roger or so on couldn't create the end all be all version of Bond each Bond from that point afterwords would analyze to improve their performance. But still, after 50 years and 5 actors succeeding him, Sean is still the one we look to for the Bond blueprint. Not because he was first, but because he embodied Bond the best with a wonderful mix of cold brutality, suave control and out of this world confidence.

    Amen! No truer words have been spoken.
  • Tee144Tee144
    edited August 2013 Posts: 8
    QOS is up alongside FRWL and Dr No the best Bond films.

    Goldeneye is bottom 5 entry and the love I used to have for it I'm sure must have come largely from the game during my teens.

    OHMSS doesn't do it for me either, another in many peoples top picks.

    TWINE is the best Brosnan and his performance in it is one of the coolest Bonds we've seen.

    All Bonds should have a good 15/20 minute scenes in London. Skyfall, TWINE and DAD all benefit from it. The charater and place just works hope it continues in Bond 24.

    The acting of Stacey Sutton and Dr Jones doesn't bother me too much and I rate them highly as Bond girls.

    Octopussy is not Roger/Bond trying to be funny, I find it genuinely funny.

  • BennyBenny Shaken not stirredAdministrator, Moderator
    Posts: 15,132
    Perilagu_Khan wrote:
    1. DAF is a classic Bond picture.
    2. GF is vastly overrated.
    3. LTK is a top four Bond entry.
    4. Newman's SF score is the best Bond score since GE.
    5. Professor Joe is a great character.
    6. Carley Simon's title track is somewhat overrated.
    7. Sheena Easton's title track is somewhat underrated.
    8. Gun's PTS is the best in series history.
    9. Elliot Carver is the best Bond villain in series history.
    10. Outside of DAD, OP is the lousiest official Bond flick ever made.

    Explain yourself Mr.Khanners.
    Surely a typo.

    Agree with #5 #7 #9
  • 002002
    Posts: 581
    Perilagu_Khan wrote:
    1. DAF is a classic Bond picture.
    2. GF is vastly overrated.
    3. LTK is a top four Bond entry.
    4. Newman's SF score is the best Bond score since GE.
    5. Professor Joe is a great character.
    6. Carley Simon's title track is somewhat overrated.
    7. Sheena Easton's title track is somewhat underrated.
    8. Gun's PTS is the best in series history.
    9. Elliot Carver is the best Bond villain in series history.
    10. Outside of DAD, OP is the lousiest official Bond flick ever made.

    1. Agreed
    2. Agreed
    3. Agreed
    4. Disagree though i do enjoy his Komodo Dragon Track
    5. Agree
    6. Disagree
    7. Definetly agree
    8. Wait what?
    9. Disagree
    10. Massively disagree
    pachazo wrote:
    1) DN is overrated - I like the film but I think that it pales in comparison to much of what came after it.
    Agree its an okay bond film a bit pedestrian compared to the other bond films

    2) The ending of FRWL was ruined - The novel had an incredible ending but the movie played it safe.
    agreed they should have kept it as a cliffhanger and move into goldfinger

    3) NSNA is better than TB - Not by much but overall I find it to be a more enjoyable experience. In particular, the casting of Largo, Domino and Leiter are huge upgrades this time around and Connery gives his best performance since the original TB.
    maybe

    4) MR is underrated - I'm not saying that it's great but I do think that it entertains more than it disappoints. Also, Michael Lonsdale is great as Drax.
    well its good in places- its a film that you can either love it or hate it but it is entertaining
    5) LTK is one of the worst Bond films - There was a time when I was not in the minority with this opinion but apparently that time has passed. Dalton and Davi give good performances but that's the only positive thing that I can say about it.
    No i think that its stunts, music and gritty feel make it one of the best bond films ever (atleast below Goldeneye and OHMSS
    6) TWINE is the second best Brosnan film - I find the film to be disappointing but not terrible. It also helps that I don't think too highly of TND and DAD.
    Twine is good not perfect but it feels like a good send off to the original Bond Movie formula and the bittersweet fairwell to Q
    7) QoS is underrated - Sure, it's flawed but I don't see it anywhere near the bottom of my Bond rankings.

    disagree to the extreme
  • Perilagu_KhanPerilagu_Khan
    Posts: 2,483
    Ahem. Well, yes, sorry about that Octobenny.

    ;)

  • MayDayDiVicenzoMayDayDiVicenzo Here and there
    Posts: 5,080
    Ok, AVTAK is in my top three...I will describe in detail why inthe near future...
  • Dr_YesDr_Yes
    Posts: 169
    MayDayDiVicenzo wrote:
    Ok, AVTAK is in my top three...I will describe in detail why inthe near future...

    Perhaps one reason is you like May Day? AVTAK is not in my top three but I recently raised it from my bottom two.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    edited August 2013 Posts: 6,396
    Dr_Yes wrote:
    MayDayDiVicenzo wrote:
    Ok, AVTAK is in my top three...I will describe in detail why inthe near future...

    Perhaps one reason is you like May Day? AVTAK is not in my top three but I recently raised it from my bottom two.

    Yes not in my bottom two either (it will take a completely shocking film to shift DAD and DAF from the bottom of my pile) but certainly nowhere near the top.

    I heard this theory years ago and it's kind of inline with the whole "codename" theory crap.

    Bond undergoes plastic surgery in order to keep his identity hidden from his enemies, which is meant to explain the change of actors.

    Of course this is such an inane theory as it would mean Bond first looked like Connery, had surgery (Lazenby), didn't like that look so changed back (Connery), probably decided wig was dodgy at that point so changed to (Moore), decided to keep that look long past the point he should have before changing for something more youthful (Dalton), wasn't happy with this look for long either, probably thought he looked too intense so another bout of surgery was called for (Brosnan), was quite happy with the dashing good looks but eventually, thanks to some iffy icebergs, felt his reputation was being laughed at so changed for the buff, young n blonde look (Craig).

    Actually, reading that back, it all seems perfectly feasible.............. X_X
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    WillyGalore wrote:
    Dr_Yes wrote:
    MayDayDiVicenzo wrote:
    Ok, AVTAK is in my top three...I will describe in detail why inthe near future...

    Perhaps one reason is you like May Day? AVTAK is not in my top three but I recently raised it from my bottom two.

    Yes not in my bottom two either (it will take a completely shocking film to shift DAD and DAF from the bottom of my pile) but certainly nowhere near the top.

    I heard this theory years ago and it's kind of inline with the whole "codename" theory crap.

    Bond undergoes plastic surgery in order to keep his identity hidden from his enemies, which is meant to explain the change of actors.

    Of course this is such an inane theory as it would mean Bond first looked like Connery, had surgery (Lazenby), didn't like that look so changed back (Connery), probably decided wig was dodgy at that point so changed to (Moore), decided to keep that look long past the point he should have before changing for something more youthful (Dalton), wasn't happy with this look for long either, probably thought he looked too intense so another bout of surgery was called for (Brosnan), was quite happy with the dashing good looks but eventually, thanks to some iffy icebergs, felt his reputation was being laughed at so changed for the buff, young n blonde look (Craig).

    Actually, reading that back, it all seems perfectly feasible.............. X_X

    This is the theory publically endorsed by Tamahori at one point. That alone is enough to prove that the man was nowhere near equipped to helm a Bond picture. All you ask of a director is 'respect'. Not an 'awareness' of a Bond film in the vaguest sense, but an understanding. Anyone with decent aspirations of directing a Bond would never suggest such tosh.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    Ah I knew I heard it somewhere, was just a matter of where. To be honest I blame Michael and Barbara far more than Tamahori for the travesty that was DAD. What were they thinking in hiring this guy? He must have been able to blag a job better than Lazenby!! You only had to look at his CV to realise he wasn't A-list director material and should have been let nowhere near Bond. You'd have thought they'd have learnt their lesson after the fiasco of Spottiswoode.
  • RC7RC7
    edited August 2013 Posts: 10,512
    WillyGalore wrote:
    Ah I knew I heard it somewhere, was just a matter of where. To be honest I blame Michael and Barbara far more than Tamahori for the travesty that was DAD. What were they thinking in hiring this guy? He must have been able to blag a job better than Lazenby!! You only had to look at his CV to realise he wasn't A-list director material and should have been let nowhere near Bond. You'd have thought they'd have learnt their lesson after the fiasco of Spottiswoode.

    Ah, but here we disagree. Spottiswoode was responsible for that little gem 'Deadly Pursuit' starring the one and only Sidney Poitier. I am, I must admit, a TND admirer and believe Spottiswoode did a more impressive job of the 'difficult second album' than Forster - Both of which were hampered by similar problems. As for Tamahori, yes, responsibility must lie with B&M but Christ, I have sympathy for them, I don't in my wildest imagination believe they thought he'd do what he did. Barbara admired his talent based on 'Once Were Warriors' and interviews at the time point to her believing Tamahori could get the character work up to scratch. Tamahori basically performed the biggest directorial sucker-punch in the series.
  • RichardoRichardo
    edited August 2013 Posts: 135
    RC7 wrote:
    This is the theory publically endorsed by Tamahori at one point. That alone is enough to prove that the man was nowhere near equipped to helm a Bond picture. All you ask of a director is 'respect'. Not an 'awareness' of a Bond film in the vaguest sense, but an understanding. Anyone with decent aspirations of directing a Bond would never suggest such tosh.
    Here, here.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    RC7 wrote:
    WillyGalore wrote:
    Ah I knew I heard it somewhere, was just a matter of where. To be honest I blame Michael and Barbara far more than Tamahori for the travesty that was DAD. What were they thinking in hiring this guy? He must have been able to blag a job better than Lazenby!! You only had to look at his CV to realise he wasn't A-list director material and should have been let nowhere near Bond. You'd have thought they'd have learnt their lesson after the fiasco of Spottiswoode.

    Ah, but here we disagree. Spottiswoode was responsible for that little gem 'Deadly Pursuit' starring the one and only Sidney Poitier. I am, I must admit, a TND admirer and believe Spottiswoode did a more impressive job of the 'difficult second album' than Forster - Both of which were hampered by similar problems. As for Tamahori, yes, responsibility must lie with B&M but Christ, I have sympathy for them, I don't in my wildest imagination believe they thought he'd do what he did. Barbara admired his talent based on 'Once Were Warriors' and interviews at the time point to her believing Tamahori could get the character work up to scratch. Tamahori basically performed the biggest directorial sucker-punch in the series.

    I will see your Deadly Pursuit and raise you Turner & Hooch and Stop! Or My Mom Will Shoot. I think you'll find that is what is considered the Royal Flush of a totally underwhelming CV with regards to Mr Spottiswoode. Just watch the climax aboard the stealth boat for further proof. The direction and editing are truly woeful, I mean really all over the place.

    I still blame M&B for Tamahori mind, sucker punch or not. Why did they allow this guy so much control and creative input? If they couldn't see the appallingly bad decisions he was making, then they really needed to take full responsibility for that shambolic piece of work.

  • StirredNotShakenStirredNotShaken Toronto
    Posts: 2,402
    WillyGalore wrote:
    RC7 wrote:
    WillyGalore wrote:
    Ah I knew I heard it somewhere, was just a matter of where. To be honest I blame Michael and Barbara far more than Tamahori for the travesty that was DAD. What were they thinking in hiring this guy? He must have been able to blag a job better than Lazenby!! You only had to look at his CV to realise he wasn't A-list director material and should have been let nowhere near Bond. You'd have thought they'd have learnt their lesson after the fiasco of Spottiswoode.

    Ah, but here we disagree. Spottiswoode was responsible for that little gem 'Deadly Pursuit' starring the one and only Sidney Poitier. I am, I must admit, a TND admirer and believe Spottiswoode did a more impressive job of the 'difficult second album' than Forster - Both of which were hampered by similar problems. As for Tamahori, yes, responsibility must lie with B&M but Christ, I have sympathy for them, I don't in my wildest imagination believe they thought he'd do what he did. Barbara admired his talent based on 'Once Were Warriors' and interviews at the time point to her believing Tamahori could get the character work up to scratch. Tamahori basically performed the biggest directorial sucker-punch in the series.

    I will see your Deadly Pursuit and raise you Turner & Hooch and Stop! Or My Mom Will Shoot. I think you'll find that is what is considered the Royal Flush of a totally underwhelming CV with regards to Mr Spottiswoode. Just watch the climax aboard the stealth boat for further proof. The direction and editing are truly woeful, I mean really all over the place.

    I still blame M&B for Tamahori mind, sucker punch or not. Why did they allow this guy so much control and creative input? If they couldn't see the appallingly bad decisions he was making, then they really needed to take full responsibility for that shambolic piece of work.

    I'm still awaiting EON's formal apology for Die Another Day myself.
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