The Questionable Stuff In Your Favorite Bond Movie and Why You Love It Anyway

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  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    chrisisall wrote: »
    Max talking to Thatcher. I know it is dumb as Hell, but it makes me laugh just the same.
    What about the Delicatessen?

    Err...No.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,978
    Don't mention the Delicatessen. I did once, but I think I got away with it.
  • Posts: 11,189
    Don't mention the Delicatessen. I did once, but I think I got away with it.

    On that subject...JOHN CLEESE in the Bond films. I like him.

  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,173
    @BAIN23

    Me too! I think he did very well in DAD. TWINE was something else; he got to play the Basil Fawlty version of a quartermaster. But in DAD I felt like he had a strong act going. I always smile, even with the invisible car. I don't think he'd fit in the Craigverse but he had something fine going with the Brozzer.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,978
    I liked Cleese in Bond in Bond as well. Not so much as the bumbling R, but very much so as the sarcastic Q. Had they not gone down the reboot *spit* route, and whether Brosnan would have continued or not, I would have liked to see more of that Q.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,789
    Love for R, errr, Q!
  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,854
    I didn't hate Gustav Graves as much as others do. He wasn't a poor villain so much as he was in a poor film.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,789
    I actually like Toby a lot.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    I thought he was great.
  • He was alright for the part but I've never liked him. Too much smarm. I didn't love him, I didn't love to hate him, I just hated him. Which, at least in my opinion, is not how a Bond villain should be.

    Basically, I never enjoyed seeing him on screen (the poor dialogue didn't help). Which is a cardinal sin for a Bond villain. Same for the absolutely forgettable Kristatos.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,789
    He was alright for the part but I've never liked him. Too much smarm.
    As an individual film I'd agree, but as in a series of movies, Graves is a great addition IMO.
  • Posts: 11,189
    DrGorner wrote: »
    I thought he was great.

    Hmm...he was pretty bad but very funny. Certainly not a boring villain.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    I wish Will Yun Lee had remained the villain. They could have changed him up a bit with some prosthetic's to make him look different rather than using magic to turn Moon from a Korean to an Englishmen.
  • Murdock wrote: »
    I wish Will Yun Lee had remained the villain. They could have changed him up a bit with some prosthetic's to make him look different rather than using magic to turn Moon from a Korean to an Englishmen.

    I think I agree with this. Would have been interesting to see

  • Shooting granny in Goldfinger.
  • DrunkIrishPoetDrunkIrishPoet The Amber Coast
    Posts: 156
    QUESTIONABLE: The Lotus submarine car in TSWLM.

    WHY IT'S QUESTIONABLE: It's just too fantastic. Unreal. It even has missiles! Unbelievable. It would never work. Contrast this car with Scaramanga's adaptable flying AMC - that thing believably could fly - or Jules Verne's Nautilus in 20,000 Leagues - there's a realistic sci-fi sub for you. Yeah, the invisible car from DAD gets all the hate, but admit it: this thing is just as outlandish.

    WHY I LOVE IT ANYWAY: Who doesn't want a car like this?? It is so beautiful, and so beautifully done. The look of quiet amazement on Bach's face. The sound design and music contribute a lot to this scene too. Bond has a history of cool cars and underwater adventurizing, so we are willing to suspend our disbelief and go along for the very enjoyable ride.

    BUT TAKE BACK ONE KADAM: for the throwaway gag at the end, where Bond flips a fish out the window. How did the fish get in there? Does the Lotus leak? Do you have to wear wetsuits instead of evening clothes? Is it in danger of sinking for keeps??
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,789
    BUT TAKE BACK ONE KADAM:
    Awesome reference dude. L-)
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    edited January 2015 Posts: 7,546
    I read somewhere that Elon Musk bought one of the Lotus' from the film (drivable, but not submersible) and actually wants to turn it into an amphibian :D Hope he does it! Would make a great way to introduce Daniel's successor... "And the new James Bond is..." *drives out of the water* :D :D :D
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Take back Ken Adam? To Germany?
  • Birdleson wrote: »
    The submarine gag had a great effect on me (and the rest of the audience) in the theatre. But now I find that whole sequence pretty dull.

    The gag in and of itself, as well as a few of Moore's lines keep it fun for me. And that groovy score is energetic as hell too. The missile blowing up Naomi's helicopter is awesome too.

    Also, @SuzanneStone, I love the shooting granny without shame.
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,583
    Moore is waaaay too old to play James Bond- and by God, what's happened to his face?

    We had fresh-faced Connery first appear on our screens as a rookie agent in Dr. No, who would then go on to age naturally throughout the rest of his tenure (exception DAF, but he was just having...you know, a bad day). That same Bond would then be portrayed by Roger Moore, who would continue until AVTAK, where he is a seasoned agent, nearing retirement. And, if I might say so, he looks very well for 57 years old. Sure, his eyes look a bit vacant at times, but he still retains his charm, suaveness and good sense of humour that we have become accustomed to ever since Moore's debut in Live and Let Die. Then the ageing process would then be reversed with Dalton in 1987, you see.
    Throughout the film, Bond displays some patriarchal tendencies, owing to his age, but nevertheless he maintains his ability to do a bit of Rogering. Who can blame him? It didn't stop Sean "caterpillar brows" Connery indulging in Plenty O'Toole!

    Stunt doubles! Stunt Doubles a plenty!

    Yeah...can't argue with that. Ya know, non Blu Ray versions of the film do help though...they do!

    Bond shouldn't be canoodling with women old enough to be his daughter

    I thought Kimberley Jones (aka "five days to Alaska" woman) was perfectly fine age wise...I'm sure she'll be grateful of a bit of Rogering to make the days go by.

    As for Pola Ivanova...well, Moore and Fullerton had great chemistry. I love the nice little scene between the two in the spa.

    And, of course, the elephant in the room, a Miss Stacey Sutton: Moore never advances on her throughout the film, and acts more the patriarch- surprisingly, despite the age difference, I think they get on nicely together. It's only at the very end of the film, which ok, it wasn't needed, when Bond finally fondles with her. But what could be a more fitting ending for the longest serving James Bond actor?

    JAMES! JAMES! Geez...

    Oh come on, it's really not that bad! How else would she react in such a situation (in a burning elevator for pete's sake!!)?? Oh, alright, I'm a sucker for dumb blondes...

    Tibbet was killed too early

    As we all should know, somebody has to be the sacrificial lamb in a Bond film. Once the ally has served his/her purpose, they are bound to be knocked off in a most elaborate fashion. Tibbet fits this bill: he's helped Bond uncover Zorin's racehorse doping scheme, and so the story now needs to move on. Plus, Tibbet's death prompts some of RogBond's best lines- "Killing Tibbet was a mistake".

    How did Sutton not realise the huge blimp creeping up behind her?

    Well, bear in mind that she was only a couple of yards away from an explosion beforehand, and so naturally she would have suffered from temporary hearing loss.

    Bond and Mayday...in bed? Good God, who dreamt that up?

    Is this scene meant to be sexy in anyway? No! He's doing what he has to do for England- he was about to get caught by Zorin and Mayday themselves. It's obvious that he wasn't enjoying the Jones treatment, what with that look of horror on his face. Jones also remains strong- when she drops those robes, I can't help but think she would be thinking "oh, let's get this over with". There's also a great line afterwards: "a little restless, but I got off eventually".

    Mayday and Zorin are terrible villains

    Woh woh woh. The duo are the wackiest, most bizarre duo of villains to have braced the Bond films. I love it. The best Bond villains, period.
    Great dialogue, Walken brings his A game, and they both go out with a bang. What's not to love?

    The action scenes are tired

    There's some pretty impressive snowboarding stunts in the PTS (I'll get to this later), and the fire truck chase is a fun romp, with some good stunts and action revolving around the draw bridge. The action in Paris is also pretty good, with the jump off the Eiffel Tower and the Renault taxi jump onto the bus roof being highlights. Then of course, you have the excellent City Hall scenes, the horse chase and the climatic finale upon the Golden Gate Bridge. Great stuff.

    California Girls in the PTS- completely undercuts any tension

    I never understood why people completely disregard the PTS due to a ten second inclusion of a pop song. Sure, it's a bit unnecessary, but there are some pretty cool shots of snowboarding across the water, and doing flips and what have you...
    If you want undercutting tension, turn to the machine gun toting granny in the Goldfinger car chase.


    It's not quite my favourite release, but there is so much to love in this film!

    AVTAK is moving up the ladder for me. But I still can't bear that "California Girls" cut-in...if, for no other reason, Barry's score during that PTS is terrific. It's not as good as the OHMSS score, used during a similar ski sequence, but it's pretty damn close. And John Glen cuts it for a Beach Boys sing that is too cliche, as in this...



    Roth's cover was released just a few months prior to AVTAK. It makes me wonder if Glen or anyone else had bothered to put their finger on the pulse of pop culture at the time.

    Suffice to say, for me, it was such a misstep that I can't watch the PTS. I go straight to Duran Duran.
  • I actually prefer AVTAK's score to OHMSS's. I think it's one of Barry's best scores and I agree, California Girls coming in just destroys the mood set up by "Snow Job."

    Regardless, I can have a laugh at it and continue on.
  • Posts: 1,394
    I love the '' invisible '' car in DAD.Never understood the criticism for this vehicle.Bond fans in general seem to love the Lotus which turns into a submarine and is armed with missiles,mines,oil slicks(etc) but DAD car is criticised for being '' unrealistic '' ?

    Its a Bond movie folks and its FUN! Lighten up!
  • AstonLotus wrote: »
    I love the '' invisible '' car in DAD.Never understood the criticism for this vehicle.Bond fans in general seem to love the Lotus which turns into a submarine and is armed with missiles,mines,oil slicks(etc) but DAD car is criticised for being '' unrealistic '' ?

    Its a Bond movie folks and its FUN! Lighten up!

    I didn't mind the invisible car at all. :)
    The Lotus was better executed though, and I don't like how the BMW was used for an over-the-top action scene.
  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,854
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    I love the '' invisible '' car in DAD.Never understood the criticism for this vehicle.Bond fans in general seem to love the Lotus which turns into a submarine and is armed with missiles,mines,oil slicks(etc) but DAD car is criticised for being '' unrealistic '' ?

    Well, with the Lotus, it served a practical purpose, since it was a submarine and Stromburg had an underwater fortress. The other gadgets are just unimportant because they were there for situations where they were needed. The Vanquish was thrust into a situation where it really would not be adequate for use, since it was in a snow covered environment. Those tracks would be obvious, and should it ever snow, that invisible thing has an obvious coating telling everybody where it is. Had the Vanquish been placed somewhere else, then the only thing people would have hated about it would be the sometimes-crappy visual effects.
  • Posts: 1,394
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    I love the '' invisible '' car in DAD.Never understood the criticism for this vehicle.Bond fans in general seem to love the Lotus which turns into a submarine and is armed with missiles,mines,oil slicks(etc) but DAD car is criticised for being '' unrealistic '' ?

    Its a Bond movie folks and its FUN! Lighten up!

    I didn't mind the invisible car at all. :)
    The Lotus was better executed though, and I don't like how the BMW was used for an over-the-top action scene.

    Wasnt the Lotus used for over the top action scenes?
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    I love the '' invisible '' car in DAD.Never understood the criticism for this vehicle.Bond fans in general seem to love the Lotus which turns into a submarine and is armed with missiles,mines,oil slicks(etc) but DAD car is criticised for being '' unrealistic '' ?

    Its a Bond movie folks and its FUN! Lighten up!

    I didn't mind the invisible car at all. :)
    The Lotus was better executed though, and I don't like how the BMW was used for an over-the-top action scene.

    Wasnt the Lotus used for over the top action scenes?

    Nope a simple Car chase and underwater duel with a small submersible. Not over the top at all. You could say it was Thunderball esque.
  • Posts: 1,394
    Murdock wrote: »
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    AstonLotus wrote: »
    I love the '' invisible '' car in DAD.Never understood the criticism for this vehicle.Bond fans in general seem to love the Lotus which turns into a submarine and is armed with missiles,mines,oil slicks(etc) but DAD car is criticised for being '' unrealistic '' ?

    Its a Bond movie folks and its FUN! Lighten up!

    I didn't mind the invisible car at all. :)
    The Lotus was better executed though, and I don't like how the BMW was used for an over-the-top action scene.

    Wasnt the Lotus used for over the top action scenes?

    Nope a simple Car chase and underwater duel with a small submersible. Not over the top at all. You could say it was Thunderball esque.

    A car that turns into a submersible.A car that has stealth camoflage.Both cars have lots of gadgets.Both cars are in a chase.

    I dont really see much difference but each to their own.I personally enjoyed both of them.
  • TripAces wrote: »
    2. Silva had the whole thing planned, for years, according to Q: I don't think so. Some have said this is a major plot hole, but I also think Q is guessing. I don't think Silva had a plan, until knowing Bond was on his trail.

    Quite so, unless of course Silva has some sort of precognition and knew years before the exact date and time that M would be called to an MP's enquiry

    He also seems to know precisely which Tube station/line to blow a hole in and can predict when Bond will be nicely in the way of an oncoming train crash.
  • Posts: 1,394
    MrBlofeld wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    2. Silva had the whole thing planned, for years, according to Q: I don't think so. Some have said this is a major plot hole, but I also think Q is guessing. I don't think Silva had a plan, until knowing Bond was on his trail.

    Quite so, unless of course Silva has some sort of precognition and knew years before the exact date and time that M would be called to an MP's enquiry

    He also seems to know precisely which Tube station/line to blow a hole in and can predict when Bond will be nicely in the way of an oncoming train crash.

    He also is very confidant that Q will not plug in his laptop to the mi6 network while Bond and M are standing outside his cell and only while Bond is out of the holding room and M is at the enquiry.

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