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[mod edit] The use of the n-word in Bond Literary.
What do you make of the use of the term in the Bond novels? Any particular thoughts as to Fleming's intentions when the word was used? Serious responses only, please.
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http://www.thebondologistblog.blogspot.co.uk/2012/08/james-bond-novels-that-were-edited.html
If you look up the term "Nigger Heaven" you will see it was the name of a 1928 novel by Carl Van Vechten, an author of the Harlem Renaissance so there was no racial slight intended by Fleming here in my view, even though he prominently uses it as a chapter title in Live and Let Die.
The only other use of the term is in Diamonds Are Forever where Felix Leiter says about ordering a jegro rather than a jigger of drink so as not to offend black sensibilities in an American bar. This particular passage was also cut by the American censors!
Other than that Fleming refers to the "niggerheads" in the sea, an outdated term for "any hard black rock or stone". Apart from that, Fleming refers to his black characters as negroes or negresses, which was the standard term at the time as opposed to how we use "black" now. Obviously, negro is a dated term and today considered racially offensive.
I personally don't believe that Fleming was a racist at all; what he was was a man of his time and I can't really blame him for being that!
I think people need to read these novels from Fleming by taking into account the time they were written in. Fleming was a snob, an ex-Eton-ian boy, who started writing the Bond novels around 1953.
So that's all I can say about it. And I think that's what you also should take into account.
Unfair to judge them by today's more enlightened thinking.
I mean, clearly Fleming was a racist. But then, the vast majority of people in the West (the world really) were racist. Also there's degrees of racism. Some people are casually racist, and some people are Nazis. I don't think Fleming would have joined the KKK. And didn't he express some dislike of the Jim Crow system in the American south (perhaps I'm remembering someone else).
I would say the vast majority of people remain racist. It isn't all about skin colour. It can be about customs and language as well.
That's a rather bold and untrue statement @NicNac. Untrue if I may say so. I do however have a clear opinion about racism, which I recently posted in another topic. I want everyone to have a good look at it:
Skin colour remains the principle cause of racism but it isn't the only thing. And my point is as long as someone hates another person because of the country they come from, and their inherent language and customs, then that is racism. And in the world today most people hate somebody because of these factors.
How is that bold and untrue?
then there'd be changes ! :)) :D
Have you heard the expression "first impressions are important"? Well, Researchers have found that a first impression is made within the first seven seconds after you meet someone new.
A lot of this is formed from your upbringing, you can take on the prejudices of your family, school peers, people you respect, the media etc.
I think Racist is a very strong word and shouldn't be thrown about.
Well said, @NicNac. Racism is alive and well in all parts of the world. It may not be as blatant as the current refugee crisis in Europe, as much of it is below the surface. But the ruling class has always looked down their noses at people with a different color and culture. Great Britain built a pretty wide empire by rescuing countries from the natives, the great unwashed and coolies. The U.S. after ignoring and then killing the original habitants, imported another group of people with dark skins to rule over. We haven't come very far.
I regard the Bond novels as period pieces and accept them for when they were written.
as they happened and not, reinvented for a more PC time. Recently watching
Agent Carter ( set in 1945) a black police man stopped her for a traffic offence.
I explained to my daughter, that given it was a very up market neighbourhood
And the historical time. I very much doubt a black policeman would have been
There to stop her. As even the army was segregated then.
Don't forget Robert Mugabe, who kicked out all the white farmers because they are white......
Things really get mixed up here, so let me make two statements:
@NicNac, beeing judgemental on physical looks isn't per se racism. It's what our biology tells us to do. As you say, all factors, like upbringing, previous experiences, etc . help us 'judge'people so we know what to expect. This is both positive and negative, but in these discussions it's seen as racism because we like to focus on the negative side. I know you're a bloke. So if you walk up to an attractive lady to chat her up, is that racism? Why won't you do the same to her father? (not in the bar in the first place, allthough it might be custom in some countries, I don't know).
So when IS it racism?
It's racism if you talk negative about someone because of only one factor in that persons looks. If you willingly disadvantages someone strictly because of said trait. It might be skin colour, but could be anything else.
So, is Fleming racist? no, he isn't. He didn't use the word in a deragatory way. He doesn't just and only judge people by their looks. Quarrel beeing the obvious example.
Let me put it this way: in my country the word 'ape' (translated, of course) is sometimes used by racists. Does that make the word 'ape' a racist word? No it doesn't. (More like speciest.). Does it make apes racist? Not per sé, though I can't really know as i don't know what aprs are like. But, when used in a deragtory way to talk negative about someone only because (in this case) of his/her skin colour, that IS racist.
Fleming wrote his novels from a British colony - Jamaica - where the majority black population were treated as second class citizens.
My expectation would be that Fleming probably held what would now be regarded as racist views. He would have known and interacted with non-white people primarily in the context of servants and poor black Jamaicans. I sense that he was at best patronising and at worst a bit of a bigot. He believed in white men's rightful place being in charge and all that flows from that basic presumption. I expect his views on race were not dissimilar to those of someone like the Duke of Edinburgh.
However, all these things come in shades of grey and I don't see it as a reason to condemn Fleming outright. He may have been racist but that doesn't make him a monster necessarily. As others have said, we all have our prejudices even if we don't like to acknowledge them. We make assumptions about people based on sex, gender, class, colour, religion, disability etc. constantly. It's humanly impossible to be completely free of prejudice.
All you can do is try and be aware of your prejudices and try and ensure you treat people fairly regardless.
Yes, there were people who were horribly bigoted for bigoted sake and there were people who were clearly racist and got too much pleasure from persecuting people who were different (the KKK, Nazis), but there were also many people who were badly ill informed. Children grew up with cartoons of people from "exotic" countries being mentally inferior, savages, less than them. Were they racist because of this social norm? I think "ill-informed" is a better description.
People who believe that people from other races today are a lesser being and have every right to be put down do so despite the social norms being that these views are incorrect and wrong. I think the racist description fits better here, because it's clear today that these views are incorrect.
It's thin ice when you view someone in the past by the standards of the present.