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There are several great composers out there who can do a great Bond score. EON just need to watch a few films and figure it out, that's all
It's not fair to compare Newman to Barry's scores, there really is nothing to compare. But even David Arnold wasn't afraid to use loud brass in an action cue and used it far better than Newman does. "Come in 007, Your Time Is Up" from The World Is Not Enough is loaded with extraneous electronic cues, but there are some great brass cues that shine through (the Bond theme is good, but also the cue right before Bond uses his boat to dive underwater - that Thunderball "wah-wah" is a nice little touch). Newman's orchestral cues rarely break through the electronic beats and overwhelming bass lines. I'm not saying David Arnold's scores should be the gold standard (DAD was no good, and bits of his other soundtracks were occasionally bland), but overall they are more exciting and satisfying than Newman's drone-y, monotonous melodies...if you can even call them melodies.
If it sounds like I'm really ripping into Newman, I suppose I am. I must reiterate that I am not necessarily offended by his generic music, and it should work just fine in the film as it did in Skyfall. But I feel that James Bond deserves better, and I also feel there are other composers who would do these movies far better justice.
It's funny, I actually think Newman is a very good composer. I just don't think he's the right composer for Bond.
Furthermore, while I can appreciate your view on Newman's electronica, holding up David Arnold as a positive comparison (even though I realize you qualified yourself and did mention his use of brass) sort of hurts your argument.
Indeed... Indeed.
I look forward to discussing this score with you in a more constructive fashion once we hear it fully. In the meanwhile, I think those who are obviously missing David Arnold (whether they come out and say it or not....and I'm not suggesting you're one of them necessarily) consider that he had his chance, and for the most part, delivered sub par scores for this franchise, as evidenced by the numerous ranking games we have had here over the years. I'm personally glad to see the back of him, although he improved on his last two efforts.
Once Mendes and Newman are done with their run, I look forward to a new, appropriate composer to take Bond forward for the next 50 years.
This remark is certainly understandable. I really try to hold myself back from judging things on trailers, snippets and other piecemeal releases. It's just that after the lackluster Skyfall score and just now getting two new pieces of music that sound like Skyfall's score frustrates me. Ultimately, you are right, though. A few weeks from now I can give a more level headed review.
See, I used Arnold as an example to make the point that even he had more exciting stuff than Newman did. It would have been easy to say John Barry did it better here, here and here. I'm not a big fan of Arnold either and both Newman and Arnold suffer from many of the same issues, but I still feel that Arnold's music is more engaging than Newman's, and I accept whatever implications my opinion may imply. For the record, I don't think Arnold should return.
Absolutely.
He needs to give his scores more 'balls' for lack of a better word.
Bottom line - this is not his forte. He is not an action composer. This is why, of the two tracks posted today, the slow one is the more memorable, imho, because it plays to Newman's traditional strengths.
Point taken re: Arnold. I wondered why you did not use Barry as the comparison, but you've clarified and you're argument is more clear by using Arnold as the comparison...true.
"The 'SPECTRE' soundtrack will be released by Decca Records (owned by Universal Music Group) and it is confirmed that Sam Smith's title track 'Writing's On The Wall' will be included. The soundtrack will have the added bonus of an instrumental version of the song."
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1. Los Muertos Vivos Estan (featuring Tambuco)
2. Vauxhall Bridge
3. The Eternal City
4. Donna Lucia
5. A Place Without Mercy
6. Backfire
7. Crows Klinik
8. The Pale King
9. Madeleine
10. Kite In A Hurricane
11. Snow Plane
12. L'Americain
13. Secret Room
14. Hinx
15. Writing's On The Wall (Instrumental)
16. Silver Wraith
17. A Reunion
18. Day Of The Dead (featuring Tambuco)
19. Tempus Fugit
20. Safe House
21. Blindfold
22. Careless
23. Detonation
24. Westminster Bridge
25. Out Of Bullets
26. Spectre (End Title)
I own the following scores and listen to them often on their own with great delight (OHMSS, YOLT, Moonraker & TLD). There is rhythm, melody, characterization to these OSTs. Most importantly, I enjoy putting myself into the film at the precise point of any track. With Newman's SF score, I could not do that, save for perhaps Chimera, Severine and part of Grand Bazaar.
Bottom line, I too am VERY eager to see the FILM...not just listen to music without context, and be transported to my 'happy place' that I get to enjoy every 2-3 years with a new Bond release. Soundtrack music should help convey in sound, what the eyes are seeing on screen. It is those very rare instances when a master, such as Barry, is able to do more with music and appeal to you, beyond just your auditory sense.
So true
I totally agree with @SJK91. Skyfall OST in the movie works indeed perfectly but when i listen to it isolated it does get boring from time to time. For Bond 25 i would like either the return of David Arnold or maybe Hans Zimmer (with Nolan directing!).
...and i thought i liked David Arnold's OST's but now ... you convinced me! Except for Casino Royale, that is a trully exceptional score ("City of Lovers" and "Mr.White/My Name is Bond, James Bond" being superb!)! cheers
That said, I've appreciated what Newman has done so far with tracks like "Shanghai Drive" and "Tennyson", but without Mendes he likely won't return unless EON takes that extra step to ask him back instead of going back to Arnold. Given that Newman's soundtrack sold better and got more accolades than any of Arnold's, there are more reasons to try to keep him on board instead of Arnold. If no more Newman, I hope someone else would get the gig. I really do not want any more Barry pastiche.
This is my view as well @MakeshiftPython. I think Arnold did very good work on CR & QoS but only in comparison to what he did before.....as a standalone I still prefer the other 'one off' composers who tried to be different, including Newman (just for being different & creative). I don't like inferior derivative work, particularly when it comes to art personally.
Having said that, there are far better possible Bond composers out there imho, including Daniel Pemberton, Joe Kraemer & particularly Henry Jackman.
There are also a lot of less well known composers who could do a decent job. Jóhann Jóhannsson did great work on Sicario for example.
Newman's music is servicable within the film, but on it's own it leaves much to be desired.
My biggest request is more Bond theme. It's a James Bond movie for crying out loud. I want to hear it in full when Bond is doing something Mindblowing or when it's most needed.
As for who I'd nominate for a Bond score after Newman departs, I'd nominate Jonny Greenwood.
Alexandre Desplat always struck me as one composer who would certainly not disappoint me as being appointed, I like most of his scores I've heard.
I just think the problem is when you've had Barry scoring the films the next place is always going to be down not unless someone comes along and reinvents the approach entirely and redefines what a Bond score is.
Arnold pays homage to Barry to frequently and Newman is too fond of mood music. We need something memorable and stirring and I'm afraid we've not really truly heard that since 1987
Don't get me wrong, I liked Arnold's work for Casino Royale and The World Is Not Enough in particular. And the score for Die Another Day isn't as bad as de flick itself. I just think that it's positive and good for the franchise that each composer keeps their own sound, and Thomas Newman's sound is one of the most particular and differentiable of the entire industry. It's a style that I didn't think it would work at first. But it did IMHO in Skyfall.
Now, regarding the songs some of you have heard and the criticisms I've read, and taking into account that I haven't heard neither of both songs, I don't see why one would criticise the fact that Newman is bringing back some part of the Grand Bazaar, Istanbul when the same person has been asking for the 007 theme to come back. Barry used that theme many times, at the very least 5 times. What if the part that Newman repeats is his 007 theme? Or at least plays that part? I think that a full review can't be written until we see the result with the film itself.
To be fair to him, he was asked so by EON after Serra's Goldeneye (in which EON even asked Altman for a more Barryesque track for the chase instead of Serra's one).
This.
I think Daniel Pemberton (The Game, Man from UNCLE, Steve Jobs) and Alexandre Desplat (Largo Winch) would be interesting choice, I'm sure there are others also.