No Time To Die: Production Diary

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  • dominicgreenedominicgreene The Eternal QOS Defender
    Posts: 1,756
    bondjames wrote: »
    What do folks think about whether there will be a varied ethnic complexion of characters in this film? I think it's inevitable. As long as it doesn't come across as overt pandering to boost audience share (which I'm afraid it did for me in TLJ), I'm fine with it.

    I don't mind it, you have to represent your demographic when you're making a new film, it's inevitable.

    They're really damned if they do, damned if they don't. You will either trigger the hard left or the hard right.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2018 Posts: 23,883
    bondjames wrote: »
    What do folks think about whether there will be a varied ethnic complexion of characters in this film? I think it's inevitable. As long as it doesn't come across as overt pandering to boost audience share (which I'm afraid it did for me in TLJ), I'm fine with it.

    I don't mind it, you have to represent your demographic when you're making a new film, it's inevitable.

    They're really damned if they do, damned if they don't. You will either trigger the hard left or the hard right.
    True, regrettably. I think the trick is in the writing. If they ensure it's well done so that each character looks like they belong there, rather than inserted to fill a diversity quota, I'll be perfectly fine with it. I just don't want it to appear obvious, and the writing is the trick to ensuring that, as is the acting.
    Since bond films follow trends, what are the odds we get a LOGAN style bond film?
    It's difficult to say. There was a lot of chatter about this being what drew Craig back at Broccoli's urging in April 2017, around the time that he was doing Othello. It's possible, but I think it was more likely to be a key component with the P&W script. Since the Boyle idea came much later, I'd be surprised if the Logan angle is significant. I certainly hope not at least. Presumably if they do, it will be at Broccoli/Craig's urging to address his arc, which whether we like it or not, has direct continuity at its core.
  • Posts: 17,753
    For someone who hasn't seen Logan, how would a "Logan angle" look like, you think?
  • Goldeneye0094Goldeneye0094 Conyers, GA
    Posts: 464
    I would like to see bond 25 be heavily inspired by Logan in some way but not have bond be an old and broken down man like wolverine was in that film plus we already saw a broken bond in skyfall no need in repeating it again but I am still open to the idea of bond's death at the end
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,968
    I don't think there's any way they could "kill off" Bond at the end that I'd enjoy. Would be a big downer of an ending to an era for me if they went that route.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    For someone who hasn't seen Logan, how would a "Logan angle" look like, you think?
    I'm not saying there will be a Logan angle, but if they were to try to draw from the film, then themes such as regret, sacrifice, aging, consequence, learning, wisdom and mentoring (sorry people, I realize it's a sensitive subject) could play a part.

    If he can wrap that into something that also serves (subtly mind you) to inform the UK's current sense of place in the world (which is unsure), using Bond as an allegory, then he may have a winner.

    The trick is not to be morose (which I thought that film was), but instead upbeat visually & thematically. I think Boyle can do that.

    All speculation though. I have no idea if Logan will play any part. For all I know, it won't.
  • Posts: 12,837
    bondsum wrote: »
    oh god, i've just noticed that John Hodge co-scripted the abomination that was 'The Sweeney' remake.....
    I'm unsure of how this adaption came to fruition? Could it be that Nick Love (its co-writer and director) should bare more of the blame than Hodge, I dunno? Out of interest has anyone seen Antigang (2015) which was re-titled The Sweeney: Paris? That too was written by Hodge from another Nick Love idea, though my understanding was it is just a point-for-point remake of The Sweeney.

    Talking of which, did you see the gritty cinematic spin-off from the popular TV series called Sweeney! (1977) @LeonardPine? I saw this in the cinema at the time when it was an X-certificate. There was sequel too, Sweeney 2 (1978) which was a AA.

    I liked The Sweeney for what it was (obviously not a patch on the original show though), and to be fair it was in development hell for years before it came out. All sorts of different people were attached to it including Daniel Craig at one point. So it probably had a lot of different cooks putting in ideas over the years, I'm not sure how much of it can be blamed on Hodge.

    The guy wrote Shallow Grave and both Trainspotting films so I'm really excited, especially with Boyle directing. Those two just seem to be a winning combo imo.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Daniel Craig would still make a terrific Jack Regan. Not sure who would be a great George Carter alongside Craig’s Regan. Paul Bettany perhaps?
  • Posts: 3,333
    Thanks @ClarkDevlin and @thelivingroyale for your additional remarks and info on Hodge's The Sweeney. I just did a little crosschecking and I can see that at one time they had Jason Statham or Michael Fassbender lined up for the Plan B part (as George Carter)!!
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 3,996
    bondsum wrote: »
    oh god, i've just noticed that John Hodge co-scripted the abomination that was 'The Sweeney' remake.....
    I'm unsure of how this adaption came to fruition? Could it be that Nick Love (its co-writer and director) should bare more of the blame than Hodge, I dunno? Out of interest has anyone seen Antigang (2015) which was re-titled The Sweeney: Paris? That too was written by Hodge from another Nick Love idea, though my understanding was it is just a point-for-point remake of The Sweeney.

    Talking of which, did you see the gritty cinematic spin-off from the popular TV series called Sweeney! (1977) @LeonardPine? I saw this in the cinema at the time when it was an X-certificate. There was sequel too, Sweeney 2 (1978) which was a AA.

    I liked The Sweeney for what it was (obviously not a patch on the original show though), and to be fair it was in development hell for years before it came out. All sorts of different people were attached to it including Daniel Craig at one point. So it probably had a lot of different cooks putting in ideas over the years, I'm not sure how much of it can be blamed on Hodge.

    The guy wrote Shallow Grave and both Trainspotting films so I'm really excited, especially with Boyle directing. Those two just seem to be a winning combo imo.

    Don't forget, the Trainspotting films are based on original novels, not that i'm taking anything away from Hodges excellent adaptations.

    I'm sure it'll be a good script.

    Just hope in a couple of months we don't start hearing about P&W rewrites.....
  • Posts: 17,753
    bondjames wrote: »
    For someone who hasn't seen Logan, how would a "Logan angle" look like, you think?
    I'm not saying there will be a Logan angle, but if they were to try to draw from the film, then themes such as regret, sacrifice, aging, consequence, learning, wisdom and mentoring (sorry people, I realize it's a sensitive subject) could play a part.

    If he can wrap that into something that also serves (subtly mind you) to inform the UK's current sense of place in the world (which is unsure), using Bond as an allegory, then he may have a winner.

    The trick is not to be morose (which I thought that film was), but instead upbeat visually & thematically. I think Boyle can do that.

    All speculation though. I have no idea if Logan will play any part. For all I know, it won't.

    Was thinking more if it were to be a Logan angle, of course. Those themes you listed there are themes I'd find hard to enjoy in a Bond film - even more so with the two last Bond films in mind. There is a need for an upbeat film now, if you ask me. You can only play off that dark and emotional angle for so long.
  • Posts: 12,837
    Daniel Craig would still make a terrific Jack Regan. Not sure who would be a great George Carter alongside Craig’s Regan. Paul Bettany perhaps?

    I think it was meant to be Craig as Carter. Ray Winstone was cast as Regan very early on iirc, years before it came out.
    bondsum wrote: »
    Thanks @ClarkDevlin and @thelivingroyale for your additional remarks and info on Hodge's The Sweeney. I just did a little crosschecking and I can see that at one time they had Jason Statham or Michael Fassbender lined up for the Plan B part (as George Carter)!!

    Orlando Bloom was the worst rumour for me. I remember reading that it was between him and Craig and praying that Craig would get it.
  • Posts: 3,333
    Orlando poshboy Bloom playing George Carter? Deary me, no wonder it was in development hell. Whilst Ray Winstone was a good-fit as an East Ender type, he was too portly to play a physical Jack Regan.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Daniel Craig would still make a terrific Jack Regan. Not sure who would be a great George Carter alongside Craig’s Regan. Paul Bettany perhaps?

    I think it was meant to be Craig as Carter. Ray Winstone was cast as Regan very early on iirc, years before it came out.
    I see. Not a bad casting choice at all, as I could definitely still see Winstone as Regan. Craig would've made a great Carter some years ago, but he has matured a lot since, as I see him more as the leading presence on the screen rather than a sidekick. Just my two cents.
  • Posts: 2,107
    Um
    oh god, i've just noticed that John Hodge co-scripted the abomination that was 'The Sweeney' remake.....

    You talkin' bout Sweeney Todd.? Have not seen it in while. But you're not talking about that movie, are ya?
  • Posts: 2,107
    bondjames wrote: »
    What do folks think about whether there will be a varied ethnic complexion of characters in this film

    As long as it's not inplemented in to the movie like Rose was in TLJ. That chatacter was just garbage, made to sell SW to chinese audiences.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2018 Posts: 23,883
    bondjames wrote: »
    For someone who hasn't seen Logan, how would a "Logan angle" look like, you think?
    I'm not saying there will be a Logan angle, but if they were to try to draw from the film, then themes such as regret, sacrifice, aging, consequence, learning, wisdom and mentoring (sorry people, I realize it's a sensitive subject) could play a part.

    If he can wrap that into something that also serves (subtly mind you) to inform the UK's current sense of place in the world (which is unsure), using Bond as an allegory, then he may have a winner.

    The trick is not to be morose (which I thought that film was), but instead upbeat visually & thematically. I think Boyle can do that.

    All speculation though. I have no idea if Logan will play any part. For all I know, it won't.

    Was thinking more if it were to be a Logan angle, of course. Those themes you listed there are themes I'd find hard to enjoy in a Bond film - even more so with the two last Bond films in mind. There is a need for an upbeat film now, if you ask me. You can only play off that dark and emotional angle for so long.
    I couldn't agree more. I'm cognizant of the fact that this is a Daniel Craig Bond film though, and so some level of angst is perhaps unavoidable. It is my hope that it is reasonably contained by Boyle and that no matter what he does, he ends the film on an upbeat 'high note' to stoke our enthusiasm for the future (of Bond, and by extension, of Britain).
  • Posts: 12,837
    Daniel Craig would still make a terrific Jack Regan. Not sure who would be a great George Carter alongside Craig’s Regan. Paul Bettany perhaps?

    I think it was meant to be Craig as Carter. Ray Winstone was cast as Regan very early on iirc, years before it came out.
    I see. Not a bad casting choice at all, as I could definitely still see Winstone as Regan. Craig would've made a great Carter some years ago, but he has matured a lot since, as I see him more as the leading presence on the screen rather than a sidekick. Just my two cents.

    Yeah I agree. Wouldn't work as Carter now but I think at the time it was rumoured (after CR, but before QoS I think) him and Winstone would have been a great combination.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Daniel Craig would still make a terrific Jack Regan. Not sure who would be a great George Carter alongside Craig’s Regan. Paul Bettany perhaps?

    I think it was meant to be Craig as Carter. Ray Winstone was cast as Regan very early on iirc, years before it came out.
    I see. Not a bad casting choice at all, as I could definitely still see Winstone as Regan. Craig would've made a great Carter some years ago, but he has matured a lot since, as I see him more as the leading presence on the screen rather than a sidekick. Just my two cents.
    Yeah I agree. Wouldn't work as Carter now but I think at the time it was rumoured (after CR, but before QoS I think) him and Winstone would have been a great combination.
    Indeed.
  • edited May 2018 Posts: 17,753
    bondjames wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    For someone who hasn't seen Logan, how would a "Logan angle" look like, you think?
    I'm not saying there will be a Logan angle, but if they were to try to draw from the film, then themes such as regret, sacrifice, aging, consequence, learning, wisdom and mentoring (sorry people, I realize it's a sensitive subject) could play a part.

    If he can wrap that into something that also serves (subtly mind you) to inform the UK's current sense of place in the world (which is unsure), using Bond as an allegory, then he may have a winner.

    The trick is not to be morose (which I thought that film was), but instead upbeat visually & thematically. I think Boyle can do that.

    All speculation though. I have no idea if Logan will play any part. For all I know, it won't.

    Was thinking more if it were to be a Logan angle, of course. Those themes you listed there are themes I'd find hard to enjoy in a Bond film - even more so with the two last Bond films in mind. There is a need for an upbeat film now, if you ask me. You can only play off that dark and emotional angle for so long.
    I couldn't agree more. I'm cognizant of the fact that this is a Daniel Craig Bond film though, and so some level of angst is perhaps unavoidable. It is my hope that it is reasonably contained by Boyle and that no matter what he does, he ends the film on an upbeat 'high note' to stoke our enthusiasm for the future (of Bond, and by extension, of Britain).

    I think the serious tone of the Craig films will at some extent be present in Bond 25, too - whether er like it or not. We can at least look back at the Craig era as one with consistency in tone, though.

    AN upbeat 'high note' (as you mention) at the end (like the CR ending) will be a good way to end the film - and potentially the Craig era. If Boyle can keep a good mix of the angst, and introduce some classic Bond entertainment, we might be in for a treat.
  • JeffreyJeffrey The Netherlands
    Posts: 308
    I think the serious tone of the Craig films will at some extent be present in Bond 25, too - whether er like it or not. We can at least look back at the Craig era as one with consistency in tone, though.

    The Craig era may have a overall serious tone, but I feel there is still quite a difference between CR / QOS in comparison to SF / SP. With the first two films it was, to me, obvious they went for a more grounded and serious route. I hope they go back to that for B25 since I feel that is when Craig is at his best.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Jeffrey wrote: »
    I think the serious tone of the Craig films will at some extent be present in Bond 25, too - whether er like it or not. We can at least look back at the Craig era as one with consistency in tone, though.

    The Craig era may have a overall serious tone, but I feel there is still quite a difference between CR / QOS in comparison to SF / SP. With the first two films it was, to me, obvious they went for a more grounded and serious route. I hope they go back to that for B25 since I feel that is when Craig is at his best.

    CR struck the perfect tone for me. It was grounded, but completely exhilarating and bursting with life and energy. I felt they lost that with QoS, but regained it again with SF (not to the extent of CR), then SP slots in as a slightly schizophrenic piece. Overall it still feels pretty coherent as an era.

    If they can tone down the Mendes style fan service and reclaim some of the effervescence of CR, I’ll be very happy.
  • Goldeneye0094Goldeneye0094 Conyers, GA
    Posts: 464


    Obviously reports of vic armstrong's involvement were just rumors and according to jamesbonddownunder Ben Cooke is the most likely to be stunt coordinator
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,968
    Wasn't he the stunt coordinator for CR and QoS? Hot damn, I'd be more than happy to have him return.
  • Posts: 17,753
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Wasn't he the stunt coordinator for CR and QoS? Hot damn, I'd be more than happy to have him return.

    +1. CR and QoS really delivered in that department.
  • Posts: 4,619
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Wasn't he the stunt coordinator for CR and QoS? Hot damn, I'd be more than happy to have him return.
    No, Gary Powell was the stunt coordinator on all 4 Craig Bond movies.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2018 Posts: 23,883
    archivo007 reported in October of last year that Cooke (who used to be Craig's stunt double) had been promoted to stunt coordinator for B25. Birth Movies Death picked up the story.

    https://birthmoviesdeath.com/2017/10/25/bond-talk-after-dark-all-the-prime-in-the-world

    Not sure if it was discussed here at the time. I think it was.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Ben Cooke was only the stunt double for Craig on all of his entries if I recall, and was the stunt coordinator for the Craig-centered Bond video games, Blood Stone and GoldenEye 007: Reloaded.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Julie T. and the M.G.'s
    Posts: 7,021
    article-0-0BE3437C00000578-809_634x478.jpg"You thought Vic would work on Bond 25? Nope, he's staying right here with me, in the Brosnan era!"
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    I understood why they may've wanted to go the Armstrong route-- so happy that he won't be a part of B25.

    I know enough guys that worked with him in the past, and, respect to his legacy- yes he's a great second unit guy with history, no doubt- he's also been known as quite difficult and unlikeable to work with. His ego is huuuuuge.....

    Plus it means fresher stunts with a new co-ordinator.....
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