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Why don't the Russian submarine crew get released in TSWLM?
We only see the British and US submariners fighting in the end batle. What happened to the Ruskis?
But why would the audience know what the real head of the service is called? People in Texas aren't going to know that. And why isn't M called C in that case? He just appears to pluck a random letter out of the air. He should be D really.
I get that it's an insult, but jokes like that only really work if there's a double meaning: that's why M's 'careless' gag at the end works. There should be a more innocuous, logical reason for him to be C before we can make c-word gags.
I think Mattjoes' explanation about him being head of CNS is probably more on the money, they just slipped up in the scene.
It's not like he's a major recurring character in the Bond series. Pretty sure he's not reappearing in Bond 26.
I think it’s just a case of the filmmakers having British audiences in mind first over US audiences. In SF there’s the moment where Bond refers to Q still having “spots”, which is not a term used in the US.
But you know what he's referring too right?
Afterall, Bond is and should remain an English character.
I guess, but that's a pretty niche bit of knowledge for most people, even British ones. And as I say, it doesn't really fit with M not being called C if that's the reasoning: plus Denbeigh's job doesn't actually exist in the real world. It's a strange gag- it'd be fine if Denbeigh had given himself the name of C because he wouldn't need to explain it, but because Bond does it it becomes a bit puzzling.
Acne?
I always felt that the Bond films started to feel Americanized starting with GE. Brosnan calling a lift an “elevator” in TND, Craig calling a mobile phone a “cellular phone”. With SF it felt like there was a concerted effort to bring back British vernacular.
That’s because C is M’s boss.
Well yeah, it fits with M and Q and all that, but it's unclear in that scene why Bond picks C of all letters, or that Denbeigh doesn't question it.
as Codename C. Bond replies. "I hope we'll be able to get a decent cup of coffee around here now." Neither this nor the final version are especially witty.
That's right. Who the hell is going to know that?
Agreed. We can change bits of his character, but he remains a British spy, no?
No. SIS is MI6, and in the Bond films, the head of MI6 is called M. Therefore, the line would only make sense if Bond said "I suppose we should call you M now", or if Bond's boss had been called C in the preceding films.
But the logic is wrong anyway, because Denbigh isn't the head of SIS, but a new agency called Centre for National Security, which combines MI5 and MI6 (also known as SIS).
I'm with Mattjoes; it doesn't work for me either. Not least because we know the head of SIS's codename is M. And Denbeigh isn't head of SIS anyway; it's an entirely new role which never existed before (and doesn't exist in the real word) so it's unclear where Bond is getting this from. I think, as Pike said, it just needed the word 'Chief' in there.
Ah, ok, fair enough - I was under the impression that SIS included both MI5 and MI6. Good to clear that up, mattjoes. Bond's response does clearly demonstrate that Denbigh is to be called 'C' as a result of him being the head of the new combined organisation, though, right? Otherwise, it really wouldn't make sense that he would only be called 'C' 'now', ie. after him being appointed to his new role.
Going forward, can the Bond films work on a cheaper budget, with less globetrotting?
A more single location story perhaps. I'm not suggesting this to be the way the series should go, but a possible route. A tighter budget, with a good story would be very different too what we've had before.
Bond should always retain his Britishness, my old friend.
Actually, I would like to spend several pages discussing the shoes Bond wears. (Of course I'm being snarky. I quite agree. Way too much time discussing the third letter of the alphabet.)
But to your point, I would enjoy seeing a Bond film that appreciates London. Something Hitchcockian, perhaps along the lines of North by Northwest or The 39 Steps. I want to see Bond pursued without all the ever so convenient gadgetry that anticipates a specific dire situation.
A London based Hitchockian affair would be great.
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By the way, I'll be soon creating a new thread to discuss the "C-issue", as I now refer to it. There's so much more to talk about, and we need to put all our heads together to explore this important subject from every angle. I don't want this topic to continue to coexist in this thread with the talk about the future of the Bond films-- something that, quite frankly, is of secondary importance.
Any ideas for the thread title? I've got one so far:
"The C-issue: Were the writers of Spectre careless or just c***s?"
(last word pronounced see-triple-asterisks)
“Now we know what C stands for.”
Have you seen Fleabag @mtm ?
Andrew Scott is pretty good in that. I think it's the writing he got for SP that let him down. From the get go, the audience know he's a bad guy. But perhaps that's the intention. We know he's bad, so let's call him C, as in the C-word.
And we all laughed and we laughed. Or so they thought.
The London-set Bond adventure is an interesting idea. I liked the old The Avengers episode where Steed and an enemy spy are trapped in a deserted London and are hunted by a rogue team of soldiers (they remixed it for The New Avengers, iirc). I find the idea of being pursued through a city that should be bustling but is now empty very creepy and nightmare-like. Could be an interesting angle for a film.