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A few people on this site, including myself, work in this industry, and, it’s flipping struggling man. It’s really struggling. Fall Guy shoulda been a hit. Bad Boys 4 was something no one asked for, yet was a hit. We’ve had two animated films bouncing back from all the other animated films that have recently failed. We have writers rooms that are being chopped, less greenlighting of projects, actors (and I’m not talking about the 1% Bale-types, but working actors), who have been out of work for the last three years: we have famous stunt ppl picking up piecemeal work and haven’t had a real job for two to three years.
Don't listen to Breitbart, 😂, who makes this claim over and over.
It truly is insulting to hear one say they don’t believe how bad of a state this industry is in, when people are literally selling their homes, leaving Los Angeles, picking up odd jobs to make ends meet. What do you base this on, @Zekidk ?? I can tell you about two projects we’ve held onto over the last year and one is finally about to go before the camera — but several times we almost went under. I may be a dummy in most things, but I actually know what I’m talking about when it comes to this subject.
To be clear, I don't think they're postponing anything fully due to one reason or the other. But as I've said in the past I think this time round there's no obvious indication of where to go for Bond 26. We're not in 2005 where the criticisms about Brosnan's films necessitated a big change in direction. At the same time we're not in a situation where the consensus is people want a 'lighter' Bond movie. Add to that these circumstances and it may well be the right move to wait a bit. Obviously time will tell though...
Pre-Covid and strikes, and for long stretches, the box office was pretty predictable. You knew why a film was dumped in February.
You knew why others were getting releases in late October through to end of December.
You could predict what certain blockbuster/summer tentpoles were going to make in May or June or July.
That’s all out the window right now. The estimates for Twisters started at 40 million bucks, 😂. No one saw the tsnunami that took place last weekend.
But yet, it’s underperforming internationally.
Dune 2 made $700 million-plus. I gather this successful sequel if released in 2019 would have made one hundred and fifty million more (pre-Covid and strikes).
There is change afoot (some of it much needed), and this is disruptive to what films get greenlit (and for how much dough (one of my projects, The Circle, has been slashed, including our fees. But if we want to see it made, we all took a hit to the wallet. This wouldn’t have happened a few years ago. Not for a psychological thriller).
This. As someone who has worked in cinemas and box office admin, the box office really is in stormy waters because as @007HallY said, audiences aren't responding to what they have typically have pre-pandemic / strikes. It's no longer wise or feasible for cinemas to assume that a Marvel film will have a sold out first week, nor will an animated kids film sell out during school holidays. What was once almost a certainty, no longer is.
The problem is they've prioritized odd-ball, no name characters with weak storylines.
But I also think if Eon released NTTD in summer '22 it would have made an extra $100m or more.
Our local big chain cinema, located in a major shopping centre next to the dinning precinct, used to be a hive of activity, to the point that it was so busy at peak times it would turn people off. Nowdays, there's barely anyone there and no front of house staff. It actually isn't clear where you pay for candy bar items if you don't buy them off the app/website. If you can't use the ticket machines, to bad, there's no staff to help you, and the bathrooms are straight out of Trainspotting.
Our local independent cinema used to be deader than a corpse, the owner refused to modernise or spend money on proper advertising and social media, word of mouth shall prevail. It averaged a dozen ticket sales during weekdays, and barely a hundred on weekends. It didn't fair much better during peak times outside of school holidays. Finally the owner sold. The new owners have breathed life into the place, and it is busy during peak times once more. But busy during off peak times has never recovered from the cinemas neglect nor changing times. It is now closed Mon-Wed and generates extra income from live events and an attached ice cream store.
Multiplexes are putting the nail in their own coffin by neglecting even the most basic and mundane aspects of their business, while independents can't make ends meat unless they have a side hustle to generate extra income. It never used, and doesn't have to be like this, but alas, it is. And there's no indication that anything is going to change any time soon.
Glenn Powell has been one of the hottest actors of the last two years, starting with his co-starring, but attention grabbing role in Maverick.
Then his starring roles in Anyone But You, and Hit Man put him on the trail to superstardom, with international appeal (not my cup of tea, personally).
The predictions internationally for Twisters wasn’t an exaggerated number. It was realistic. The lead actor isnt why it underperformed, as he is the hottest ticket of the past two years (and he is getting thrown every script available at the moment).
@DEKE_RIVERS , you don’t understand it’s the same thing. You know this guy, you know his face, you know his name, you know what films he’s been making BECAUSE Hollywood is selling him to us as the next movie star. That’s the way they make movie stars. Powerful people start to cultivate the person’s career (Tom Cruise, Julia Roberts…).
They might think he was an astronaut ;)
Indeed. I'd like other's thoughts but in the last ten years or so, I have felt drastically out of the loop on what's playing unless I am an avid fan of the franchise or movie. I also don't binge watch Netflix, Disney, HBO or the other apps. I have subscriptions but, I guess I have settled into my ways and generally watch my favorite older movies conveniently. I still watch what's on TV and am hard pressed to recall any movie teasers aside from a couple of obvious blockbusters that have aired. I'd like to know the dozen or so other movies are being advertised. From what I can tell it's hardly TV. Perhaps it's largely insular to their respective subscriptions like how virtually all of Disney Channel's ads are self referential. Or are the algorithms on social media (which I don't have) hastening the decline and no one ever gets to see them?
Love it.
Yeah it is, that’s how movie stars are made: the roles are cultivated, then the powers that be unleash their latest toy as often as they can, trying to squeeze out every last penny in whatever window he or she lasts in.
You’re a little contrarian aren’t you?
But, in the hopes I don’t get a smack on the wrist for replying to your all-knowingness, I’ll leave it there, in Deke Town where you’re the omnipotent force of everything and nothing at the same time, 😂.
Sorry, I missed this post of yours at first. Some good things here, so let me try to answer them.
Him saying "I honestly feel a responsibility toward all the Bond fans out there" is exactly what I think that BB does not. That's my opinion. She's giving the fans and people who interview her the runaround, hence my example.
Actually I think there is. The legacy also concerns fans and how they are treated. Cubby knew this. He listened to the fans who wanted Jaws back after TSWLM, for example. And a legacy can slowly die if you allow enough time where nothing at all happens.
Sure. We've seen it before, both with actors, producers and directors just coming off a huge franchise production. Wanting to do something else also. No one can blame them. But it's been five years - five - since the last one wrapped. And here we are in 2024 looking into at least four more years until the next one hits the theatre while keeping the fans in the dark. And as a fan, I find that unacceptable for a succesful franchise that still has a following.
I honestly have no clue as to where I have written anything about you. But with those "silly" attacks are you referring to things like this?
That's because - and you should know this because you work in the industry - it's far easier to market and sell a known commodity than something new and original. Hence the many sequels, remakes and reboots that largely make up the Top 20 the last 15 years or so. Actually there's not a single original concept in this years Top 10 so far.
I don't think the decline of linear tv has helped the matters at all. The only trailer I've seen for a big budget film this year was Fall Guy and that was largely, I suspect, due to the fact that it was filmed here.
The only other film I've seen advertised, and I mean to death, is Kinds of Kindess and that was on an FTA On Demand platform, and only because that is the only FTA channel that will air and stream it, post release.
It makes sense to cut back on linear tv advertising if audiences aren't there any more, and to focus more on where they will land post release. But it doesn't solve the problem of how to reach audiences who still rely on those declining services.
Hollywood may think he is the next big thing but that doesn't mean anything if you don't end up selling tickets.
I'm lukewarm on him, but Daisy Edgar-Jones has been good in two things I've watched, I think she'd be a draw for me (if I was still going to the cinema).
I’ll make this as short and to the point as I can:
The film was released in 2021. It’s been three years. Relax.
Just because Cubby did things his way, Barbara does it hers, doesn’t mean fans are being disrespected. You’re just upset because she doesn’t “listen to you” (whatever the hell that means. I don’t want her listening to us, or we’d have hell to pay with the sloppy, unfocused and schizophrenic films that would be released. Trust me, she knows better than you and me and all of the members on this site how to assemble a gigantic 200 million dollar picture!). In the end, her job is to make the best films she and her team can. To raise the funds, get the best talent, and, like all other filmmakers, hope you have a hit on your hands (and more often than not: she’s produced hugely successful Bond films). That’s her responsibility to us, and she delivers it. That’s it. What more do you want? Your bias has clouded your judgement, methinks. There’s no disrespect from Barbara Broccoli to her father’s legacy. I don’t think he’d think that either. It’s a ridiculous statement .
Your attacks on character are directed at Barbara. You can’t argue her talents as a producer, so it’s this: she’s ruining her father’s legacy, or disrespecting it, or whatever. If she was a hack producer, I could see your point. But these films are made with the absolute best talent. No expense is too big to get the best.
My comment about Breitbart is because the only time I’ve heard that the film industry really isn’t suffering, is from those idiots that write over there, and the people that read their uneducated, poorly researched articles.
Where did you come up with the idea that the film industry isn’t suffering at the moment? Because a film that should have made $850 million made a decent $725 million?
Where do you get your information from, if it’s not the only media (Breitbart) that repeatedly states this lie over and over?
:))
Sloppy and unfocused. That's how I consider the last two Bond movies. But that's another discussion. Meanwhile I have read countless ideas on this forum over the years that I thought was excellent. None of them include turning Bond into a family man and having him killed.
NYT had a piece that said that Hollywood's supply lines is starting to flow at capacity again and is back to its normal self (whatever that is) in 2025. The stocks somehow confirm this, I would say. WBD, Universal, Disney and especially Amazon (MGM) etc.
The Hollywood crisis that I do think there is, has nothing to do with stocks, money or jobs. But creativity. Or the lack of. Yes, once in a while there's a Nolan movie, or a movie like 'Civil War' comes along, but most movies coming from the assembly line... you know the rest.
You mean Glen Powell isn't an astronaut?! :))
As for the box office for "Twisters", it seems to be an US/global split. The following is from Variety.
The movie, a standalone sequel to the 1996 disaster epic “Twister,” has collected a massive $80.5 million from 4,151 North American theaters in its debut. Heading into the weekend, the follow-up film was projected to generate $50 million to $55 million. It’s the third-biggest opening weekend of the year behind “Inside Out 2” ($154 million) and “Dune: Part Two” ($82 million).
….
The film isn’t quite as powerful overseas, where “Twisters” has grossed $27.1 million over the weekend and $42 million in total. Globally, the movie has generated $123.2 million.
1. Twisters $80.5 million
2. Despicable Me 4 $23 million
3. Inside Out 2 $12.7 million
4. Longlegs $11.7 million
5. A Quiet Place: Day One $6.1 million
UK/Ireland
1. Despicable Me 4 £4.9 million
2. Twisters £4.1 million
3. Inside Out 2 £1.5 million
4. Longlegs £1.3 million
5. A Quiet Place: Day One £447,907
As for the impact on the production of Bond 26, due to Barbara Broccoli having a number of non-Bond projects in the works; I don't think we fully know. Sometimes, it helps to step back and use the time spent on other projects to allow one to fully reset. I do something like this at work all the time. Is that what Ms. Broccoli is doing? Again, I don't think any of us know for sure. As others have pointed out the financials of the industry are less predictable than even 10-15 years ago, and what use to be a "sure thing" is now, less so.
I do have faith that there will be a Bond 26 (Whether I still be around to see it is a different story :-?). I do, however, have concerns about the 'aging' of the US fanbase (as opposed to that in the UK), but that is a story for another post.
@Zekidk , you mean this article: https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/01/opinion/oscars-hollywood-extinction
I think you’ve glossed over the reality and the importance of their statement that after the post Oscar happiness, Hollywood is “grim” and has a ways to battle out of the doldrums we are in.
Try reading the LA Times recent articles from the last few week. They’ve published several stories about the exodus and how people who have made a living in the industry are no longer getting food on their tables. It’s very real.
But hey, why take it from any of us that actually, you know, work in this business. Just saying…
The fan pressure Olympics? I think it’s natural to want a film from the people that bring you films of one of your favourite characters. I’m not faulting anyone for that. I want another film, but I’m not going to lose my head over it and claim that Barbara Broccoli is disrespecting her father’s legacy! Thats a silly statement.
If you didn’t like the last two films (and I had my own issues with the second to last one), then that sucks. But it’s not the end of the world.
And ideas are ideas, but making them into huge successes that touched worldwide audiences, is where the true gifts of filmmakers lie. If you think we, on this site, can make one hit film after another because you heard some good ideas, then you’re being naive. I love neuroscience, and I’ve been studying it with my son (who is doing his Master’s in this field). But I don’t think i can now operate on a human brain, let alone a mouse’s!!!! 😂 😂 😂
Let’s leave it there, shall we? There’s not much juice to squeeze from this lemon. Suffice to say, we all want a new film from EoN. But as far as Barbara Broccoli ruining or disrespecting her father’s legacy? He wouldn’t buy that and I’m sure he’d find that statement insulting.
You’re right and they estimated that this is a “heartland-tale” and had estimates to reflect that, but did under that estimation, and blew the lid on the domestic numbers (the first estimate I heard was $40 million; and it doubled that like it was a cakewalk; the expectations were healthy, not a monster. It’s definitely not my type of flick, but the more successes we can have strung together, the more things will start functioning as they did before (maybe, as we all know studios are still punishing the writers for striking. They are greenlighting way less than before and are greenlighting less episodes and canceling shows for no reason. Their money piles in from Wall Street now, so they can afford to starve out those naughty men and women who dared to oppose them)
First of all, I am a fan. Just because there are certain aspects I do not like, it doesn't mean that I don't like the overall experience I get from watching a new Bond movie.
And me being naive? I have never argued that members on this forum have the capacity to make a Bond-movie. So
But there are skilled people here, also. People who also "work in the industry", who pen movies and could outdo P&W when it comes to delivering a coherent outline or first draft that excites. I've read all of P&W's scripts for the Bond movies that were floating around, even the three extremely different to SP. And I gotta tell you: there's probably a reason why they haven't done something outside the Bond franchise and other writers were asked to contribute.
Hopefully they will not return. But I hope that another fan does, David Arnold. He is not the most skilled composer compared to so many others, but he understands Bond and is passionate. Like so many here. Who also work in the industry.