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BOND POLLS 2017: Craig stays or leaves? Choose one of the four options [RESULTS, page 12]
THE BIG BOND POLL: What needs to happen with Bond #25?
A)...CONTINUE the current 'Bond Universe/Timeline' that was initiated with the 2006 reboot "CASINO ROYALE". Daniel Craig RETURNS as agent James Bond 007 for a 5th time.
Further consequences of option A):
- The 25th film and other future films will be LESS HEAVY on character background, chronology and continuity
- (Some) the other actors from the MI6-family RETURN: Ralph Fiennes, Ben Whishaw, Naomie Harris, Rory Kinnear (Jeffrey Wright)
B)...CONTINUE the current 'Bond Universe/Timeline' that was initiated with the 2006 reboot "CASINO ROYALE". Daniel Craig RESIGNS, and a NEW, 7th actor takes over the Bond mantle.
Further consequences of option B):
- The 25th film and other future films will be LESS HEAVY on character background, chronology and continuity
- (Some) the other actors from the MI6-family RETURN: Ralph Fiennes, Ben Whishaw, Naomie Harris, Rory Kinnear (Jeffrey Wright)
C)...DISPOSE of the current 'Bond Universe/Timeline' that was initiated with the 2006 reboot "CASINO ROYALE". A brand-new reboot will be initiated in which a NEW, 7th actor takes over the Bond mantle.
Further consequences of option C):
- The 25th film and other future films will be DEVOID of character background, chronology and continuity
- (Some) actors from the MI6-family RETIRE: Ralph Fiennes, Ben Whishaw, Naomie Harris, Rory Kinnear (Jeffrey Wright)
D)...DISPOSE of the current 'Bond Universe/Timeline' that was initiated with the 2006 reboot "CASINO ROYALE". Daniel Craig RETURNS as agent James Bond 007 for a 5th and final time.
Further consequences of option D):
- The 25th film and other future films will be DEVOID of character background, chronology and continuity
- (Some) actors from the MI6-family RETIRE: Ralph Fiennes, Ben Whishaw, Naomie Harris, Rory Kinnear (Jeffrey Wright)
SOME IMPORTANT NOTES:
--> There is no 5th option or an option that says "Another preference, namely....."
--> Try to choose the option that suits your preference best, how difficult that may seem at first
--> Try to strengthen or clarify your choice with examples
--> I will be tracking the results by tallying the choices
--> Once added up together, I will add percentages to each option
Why I want to do this? I want to bring some clarity in all the various opinions on this forum. I think it would be quite interesting to see which of these four options gets a majority on MI6-Community :-). Do we want Craig to retire? Or do we want him back? And moreover, I am very curious to see how you would bring one of your four choices into practice.
A)...CONTINUE the current 'Bond Universe/Timeline' that was initiated with the 2006 reboot "CASINO ROYALE". Daniel Craig RETURNS as agent James Bond 007 for a 5th time.
Further consequences of option A):
- The 25th film and other future films will be LESS HEAVY on character background, chronology and continuity
- (Some) the other actors from the MI6-family RETURN: Ralph Fiennes, Ben Whishaw, Naomie Harris, Rory Kinnear (Jeffrey Wright)
B)...CONTINUE the current 'Bond Universe/Timeline' that was initiated with the 2006 reboot "CASINO ROYALE". Daniel Craig RESIGNS, and a NEW, 7th actor takes over the Bond mantle.
Further consequences of option B):
- The 25th film and other future films will be LESS HEAVY on character background, chronology and continuity
- (Some) the other actors from the MI6-family RETURN: Ralph Fiennes, Ben Whishaw, Naomie Harris, Rory Kinnear (Jeffrey Wright)
C)...DISPOSE of the current 'Bond Universe/Timeline' that was initiated with the 2006 reboot "CASINO ROYALE". A brand-new reboot will be initiated in which a NEW, 7th actor takes over the Bond mantle.
Further consequences of option C):
- The 25th film and other future films will be DEVOID of character background, chronology and continuity
- (Some) actors from the MI6-family RETIRE: Ralph Fiennes, Ben Whishaw, Naomie Harris, Rory Kinnear (Jeffrey Wright)
D)...DISPOSE of the current 'Bond Universe/Timeline' that was initiated with the 2006 reboot "CASINO ROYALE". Daniel Craig RETURNS as agent James Bond 007 for a 5th and final time.
Further consequences of option D):
- The 25th film and other future films will be DEVOID of character background, chronology and continuity
- (Some) actors from the MI6-family RETIRE: Ralph Fiennes, Ben Whishaw, Naomie Harris, Rory Kinnear (Jeffrey Wright)
SOME IMPORTANT NOTES:
--> There is no 5th option or an option that says "Another preference, namely....."
--> Try to choose the option that suits your preference best, how difficult that may seem at first
--> Try to strengthen or clarify your choice with examples
--> I will be tracking the results by tallying the choices
--> Once added up together, I will add percentages to each option
Why I want to do this? I want to bring some clarity in all the various opinions on this forum. I think it would be quite interesting to see which of these four options gets a majority on MI6-Community :-). Do we want Craig to retire? Or do we want him back? And moreover, I am very curious to see how you would bring one of your four choices into practice.
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Comments
Now, my overall preference would be for Craig to return, give the 'MI6 family' much smaller roles, and let Bond tackle some straight forward mission. Handle the return (or departure, though hopefully it wouldn't result in her death) of Swann however is needed, sideline Blofeld for a film (he's locked up and has no influence; could possibly allow for audience reaction into having/not having him return, which would be a good indicator for what 'Bond 26' may unveil), and let Bond do what he does best.
I have no desire to see Craig resign so given that eliminates B&C immediately it is a choice between A&D.
Continuing on from SP, clunky as I'm sure it will be, seems to be the only viable way to go. To just forget about everything that has gone before after they have just tied themselves in knots connecting it all would make no sense.
The only hope (admittedly quite a forlorn one) is that the make a better job of it this time round.
Personally I'd go for a YOLT ending with Bond with amnesia but Blofeld alive.
Then if Craig comes back one last time have the M assassination attempt and then a final showdown with Blofeld. If it's a new actor in B26 you can either just start afresh or have the assassination attempt and a scrap with Blofeld who you let live on for a few more films if you so desire.
A: 5
B: 0
C: 2
D: 0
I'd be sad to see Craig go but at this point I have absolutely no desire to see a sequel to SP. And come on, how silly would it be to have only Craig return and ignore everything that happened before? That's not really a viable option. Besides, the more I think about it, SP had quite the suitable ending for the DC era. He finally ends up with the girl he loves and rides off and quits his job. Perfect.
I think that option B would be the worst of both worlds for me. We'd lose Craig and have to continue on with the SP nonsense. However, if I had to bet on it, I'd put my money on us getting option A.
I'd have to agree. It's option C for me as well.
I'd rather they just start over from square one and move forward, hopefully learning a lesson from Spectre and never deciding to force continuity into the franchise where it doesn't fit. If Bond is going to be serialized, it needs to be done with planning in advance, not by retconning like they did with Spectre.
I really am on the lookout for a standalone mission though, at some point.
A]...71%..(12 voters)
B]...00%..(00 voters)
C]...24%..(04 voters)
D]...05%..(01 voters)
The biggest problem I have with a firm re-boot, either with or without Daniel Craig, is that it's the 'law of the land' in Hollywood. It tires me a lot. And at times the re-boot button seems to be used because of an absence of inventive storytelling and lack of creativity.
What's wrong with maintaining the Craig-timeline, and then slowly make the films less heavy on chronology and personal background stuff? That's what has been done with the Bond franchise during the entire period 1962 until 2002.
Moreover, the Bond franchise is unique. Very unique...in that it's an old franchise (almost 54 years) and it has 24 films. So the films thrived on that aspect. Yes, there were occasional references to Tracy, or Judi Dench's predecessor. But that's about it.
If you start re-booting the franchise every time that a new actor comes onboard, then I think it could endanger the longevity of the franchise on the very long-term (20 to 40 years from now). Bond is no Marvel. Bond is Bond.
Hence why I prefer option A). And if that's not possible, then I think option B) should also be considered seriously.
You don't even have to call it a reboot, you just say we've done our Craig thing, we're going back to the Bond sans baggage. Chalk up DC's tenure as an experiment, it's own truncated journey from rookie to retired. No need to reboot every time, but no point sticking with a timeline that is acutely personal to Craig's portrayal. In one breath you're saying 'less focus on character background, chronology and continuity' and in the next you're saying 'let's maintain the Craig timeline'. You can't just phase out something intrinsically tied to his portrayal it's utterly pointless. Once he's done, a clean break is the most sensible and creatively freeing option. Go back to a Bond who echoes the traditional cinematic archetype, he's not a rookie, neither is he a veteran, he's an agent slap bang in the middle of his career, then keep him there for a good four or five films.
What do you mean with 'original timeline'?
He means 62-02.
I disagree. It's not that black-and-white. With 'less focus on character background, chronology and continuity' I actually mean to make references of past Bond films inferior to the plot. So in the strictest sense you are maintaining the Craig timeline, but there's less focus on all the aspects that come with that timeline.
Two examples:
Example #1: In "From Russia With Love" Kronsteen references the death of Dr Julius No in "Doctor No" and how S.P.E.C.T.R.E. can avenge that death. Is it a continuation of the timeline created in "Doctor No"? In the strictest sense: Yes. But is that bit of continuity crucial to the plot and is it part of the character backgrounds of, for example, Bond? No. So there is less focus on character background as opposed to all previous four Craig-films.
Example #2: In "The World Is Not Enough" we see in MI6's safe house in Scotland a portrait of Bernard Lee's 'M'. On top of that, James Bond tells the new 'M' in "GoldenEye": "Your predecessor kept some cognac there...". So in a way these two Brosnan outings are continuations of the timeline set in "Doctor No" (1962). So "Yes" it is a continuation of the timeline created in "Doctor No". But is that bit of continuity crucial to the plot and is it part of the character backgrounds of, for example, Bond? No. So there is less focus on character background as opposed to all previous four Craig-films.
This is my point really. You can perfectly slow down all the complicated and too densely written personal background stuff and continuity of events from previous films in an upcoming screenplay of Bond #25. Make the continuity references inferior to the main plot.
By doing so you still have the Craig-quadrilogy in place, Daniel Craig can return in a 5th film that isn't really part of the quadrilogy, Craig returns in a Bond film in which the character Bond is now even more firmly established as opposed to "SPECTRE", and you make it easier for the screenplay writers to come up with a true mission-story, without all the blabla from the past.
You miss my point and simultaneously undermine your own. The original films had no 'character' continuity, they referenced instances such as those you mentioned, but Bond as a character had no discernible journey. That's completely different with Craig. There is a character arc that doesn't exist with any other portrayal of the character, so to suggest you can simply toss that aside and instead whimsically allude to arbitrary plot points or lines of dialogue from his previous four films makes no sense.
DC is now tied to the events of his four films and they all inform each other, and I'm not talking about plot I'm talking character and the journey. From rookie to seasoned, from blunt instrument to finely tuned assassin, from unstoppable wrecking ball to burnt out has-been, from cold unemotional hitman to broken hearted. All these things were never experienced by any other Bond because Bond remained relatively steady while the films evolved around him. In these films this man has evolved and his experiences have shaped him. It's like continuing Nolan's Batman trilogy - no point. It was character-led and you taint its impact.
The two options for me are finish his journey or make a clean break.
Incidentally they seem to be 'rebooting' 24 with a new character.
All good points and I agree with you. The trick is to abandon this idea of timelines. The only timeline that really exists is Craig's. The way I've explained it in the past is the idea of looking through a prism and with each turn you're seeing a different take on Bond. There are some things that feel connected, others that don't, there are tonal shifts, narrative inconsistencies, but each film is a different skew on the myth. They're all standalone to me. In reality it's not a million miles from comic book lore, the core values and identity remains constant but the style, tone and narrative can lurch this way and that.
Dear lovely sweet and respected @RC7. You equally don't read very well what I wrote down. And if I closely read your post then we actually agree on certain things :-)!
In my opinion there IS a 1st timeline, a 1st universe with certain -very loose- elements of continuity. That is the era from 1962 until 2002. The examples I mentioned refer to that.
But I ALSO said that these examples were NEVER truly part of an extensive character exploration or story arc :-). Even if you count all the Tracy-references (TSWLM, FYEO, LTK), the events were never made part of the main plot, the villain's scheme or the entire main story of the film. Never. Kristatos never emotionally blackmailed Bond with pictures of his late wife Tracy. There is no hidden message in the portrait of Bernard Lee's portrait in "TWINE" that is meant for Bond to trace down. We NEVER saw that.
And YES, I fully agree that this is entirely different with the four Craig-films. In there the continuity and chronology go well beyond only a few references ;-). They drive the plot, by making them part of Bond's background. Hence you say Craig is tied within these four films to all the events. So I agree.
But my point now really is: Lower down all that stuff, all these complex character connections for Bond #25 :-)! Don't make them part of the main plot or villain's scheme anymore in entry #25. Don't attach a complete new mission for Bond with his past. Buttt, I still think that it is entirely possible to at least refer to some past events correctly, to maintain a certain chronology. Chronology or Continuity does not necessarily say something about how extensive that Chronology/Continuity is written in the main story. They can appear as small cameo lines (TSWLM) or as extensive plot developments (SP).
So again, for Bond #25 I prefer a TSWLM-like approach: Daniel Craig returns, small reference to how Bond broke up with Madeleine, chronological timeline stays intact, but no complex personal backgrounds a la SP. Option A) that is.