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"The things we do for frequent flyer mileage"...GoldenEye Appreciation and Discussion.

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  • MilovyMilovy
    Posts: 676
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    Very true. So sick of that lame trust thing with M. One of the reasons I was glad to see the back of Dench

    The same thing happened in SP with a new M, and I see no signs of it stopping. Can't be that hard to return to a straight-forward mission, hasn't Bond more than proved himself by now?
    No, he's still new at this. It takes a long time for a man to grow up.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    P&W out of ideas it seems. If it's true that they're back (still to be officially confirmed), they've certainly got their work cut out to be original.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    I'm betting on something from M's past blah blah bha
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    bondjames wrote: »
    No Bond film is perfect, but this as close as they've got to a crisp, light hearted formula entry filled with energy since the 80's. I subjectively prefer it to anything made since. It has the old school DNA in it.

    I preferred LTK & certainly the CR reboot personally.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,401
    CR isn't anywhere near as brisk as GoldenEye is though.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    GE isn't anywhere the script quality, cinematic flair, characterisation focus and Fleming faithfulness of CR.
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    Posts: 11,189
    CR does seem more cinematic at heart. I think GE has flair thanks to it's editing, but CR is a fair distance ahead.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Exactly.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    GE is TJ Hooker to CR's The Wire
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,401
    GE is a better Bond film than CR because it doesn't get bogged down in the same way CR does. It's a brisk film, and quite straightforward. CR was more ambitious, but a unfortunate consequence is that it ended up losing some spryness in comparison to GE.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    Dear oh dear. GE is just awful. The fact anyone is even comparing it to CR in terms of quality is hilarious.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    I may admire and respect CR more, but I personally enjoy watching GE much more.

    Up to ball beater CR is great fun. I just prefer to forget the rest of it (we all know how it's going to end).
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    I don't watch either of them very much but CR would win out every time if forced to do so.

    Campbell is a seriously overrated director around here.
  • Mathis1Mathis1
    Posts: 7,438
    Campbell had better material to work with on CR. Script, Cast, location, action were all streets ahead of GE, which is a labour to watch!
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,401
    Getafix wrote: »
    I don't watch either of them very much but CR would win out every time if forced to do so.

    Campbell is a seriously overrated director around here.

    Campbell is the second best director of the franchise.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    GE is a better Bond film than CR because it doesn't get bogged down in the same way CR does. It's a brisk film, and quite straightforward. CR was more ambitious, but a unfortunate consequence is that it ended up losing some spryness in comparison to GE.

    Yes CR gets bogged down in a brilliant Fleming plot, whilst GE follows a mediocre retread greatest hits plot. Ha ha ha ha. Its laughable to suggest GE is better anyway.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    edited May 2017 Posts: 5,131
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    I don't watch either of them very much but CR would win out every time if forced to do so.

    Campbell is a seriously overrated director around here.

    Campbell is the second best director of the franchise.

    Young and Hunt are superior.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    Campbell had better material to work with on CR. Script, Cast, location, action were all streets ahead of GE, which is a labour to watch!

    +1.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited May 2017 Posts: 8,401
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    GE is a better Bond film than CR because it doesn't get bogged down in the same way CR does. It's a brisk film, and quite straightforward. CR was more ambitious, but a unfortunate consequence is that it ended up losing some spryness in comparison to GE.

    Yes CR gets bogged down in a brilliant Fleming plot, whilst GE follows a mediocre retread greatest hits plot. Ha ha ha ha. Its laughable to suggest GE is better anyway.

    No, CR disregards Fleming, otherwise Vesper would have committed suicide and it wouldn't be Bond first mission. And they wouldn't be playing Hold'em.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    I don't watch either of them very much but CR would win out every time if forced to do so.

    Campbell is a seriously overrated director around here.

    Campbell is the second best director of the franchise.

    Young and Hunt are superior.

    Young, Hunt, Gilbert Hamilton, Hunt and Glen are all better
  • Mathis1Mathis1
    Posts: 7,438
    Most definitely Young and Hunt, though Campbell would be ahead of messrs (in every sense of the word!) Spottiswoode, Apted and Tamahori, though not Glen!. Oh, and I never liked Lewis Gilbert either.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    edited May 2017 Posts: 5,131
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    GE is a better Bond film than CR because it doesn't get bogged down in the same way CR does. It's a brisk film, and quite straightforward. CR was more ambitious, but a unfortunate consequence is that it ended up losing some spryness in comparison to GE.

    Yes CR gets bogged down in a brilliant Fleming plot, whilst GE follows a mediocre retread greatest hits plot. Ha ha ha ha. Its laughable to suggest GE is better anyway.

    No, CR disregards Fleming, otherwise Vesper would have committed suicide and it wouldn't be Bond first mission. And they wouldn't be playing Hold'em.

    General tone and outcomes are there. Vesper does commit suicide in the film? She deliberately causes the lift to drop into the water and she drowns. Have you actually seen the film??? Seems not.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited May 2017 Posts: 8,401
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    GE is a better Bond film than CR because it doesn't get bogged down in the same way CR does. It's a brisk film, and quite straightforward. CR was more ambitious, but a unfortunate consequence is that it ended up losing some spryness in comparison to GE.

    Yes CR gets bogged down in a brilliant Fleming plot, whilst GE follows a mediocre retread greatest hits plot. Ha ha ha ha. Its laughable to suggest GE is better anyway.

    No, CR disregards Fleming, otherwise Vesper would have committed suicide and it wouldn't be Bond first mission. And they wouldn't be playing Hold'em.

    General tone and outcomes are there. Vesper does commit suicide in the film? She deliberately causes the lift to drop into the water and she drowns. Have you actually seen the film???

    Have you actually read the book??? That's not how Vesper dies, it's very different. There's no sinking house.
  • CrzChris4CrzChris4
    Posts: 463
    You could argue that with any Bond film though, even the "pure" ones like DN, FRWL and OHMSS.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    GE is a better Bond film than CR because it doesn't get bogged down in the same way CR does. It's a brisk film, and quite straightforward. CR was more ambitious, but a unfortunate consequence is that it ended up losing some spryness in comparison to GE.

    Yes CR gets bogged down in a brilliant Fleming plot, whilst GE follows a mediocre retread greatest hits plot. Ha ha ha ha. Its laughable to suggest GE is better anyway.

    No, CR disregards Fleming, otherwise Vesper would have committed suicide and it wouldn't be Bond first mission. And they wouldn't be playing Hold'em.

    General tone and outcomes are there. Vesper does commit suicide in the film? She deliberately causes the lift to drop into the water and she drowns. Have you actually seen the film???

    Have you actually read the book??? That's not how Vesper dies, it's very different. There's no sinking house.

    But of course, more times than the film. But the book isn't cinematic enough to film outright and taking an overdose of pills is an anti climax on film. You stated incorrectly that Vesper didn't commit suicide in the film. CR takes the general Fleming story and updates it brilliantly. GE plays it safe, rehashes a few past plot points and creates a mediocre film to please a mass market. No Fleming plot in sight.
  • GetafixGetafix
    edited May 2017 Posts: 11,425
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    Most definitely Young and Hunt, though Campbell would be ahead of messrs (in every sense of the word!) Spottiswoode, Apted and Tamahori, though not Glen!. Oh, and I never liked Lewis Gilbert either.

    You don't like YOLT or spy?

    Sacrilege.

    He's a good director outside Bond as well
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Both great films. BUT Gilbert plays too many elements for laughs in TSWLM......he never takes it seriously enough.......he ruined MR.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited May 2017 Posts: 8,401
    I wouldn't call drowning an "update" on taking pills. If anything it's the reverse, people have been drowning for a lot longer than they having been overdosing, but let's not get macabre. My point is, the way it's portrayed as a split second decision is a betrayal of the Fleming, were Vesper is seen to be suffering for quite some time. They chickened out, in effect. They felt the need to somehow incorporate her death into an action sequence, which didn't even exist in the book.

    Ignoring Fleming altogether isn't as big an insult as taking his story and disregarding parts on a whim. Hence, GE has the upper hand.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    I wouldn't call drowning an "update" on taking pills. If anything it's the reverse, people have been drowning for a lot longer than they having been overdosing, but let's not get macabre. My point is, the way it's portrayed as a split second decision is a betrayal of the Fleming, were Vesper is seen to be suffering for quite some time. They chickened out, in effect. They felt the need to somehow incorporate her death into an action sequence, which didn't even exist in the book.

    Ignoring Fleming altogether isn't as big an insult as taking his story and disregarding parts on a whim. Hence, GE has the upper hand.

    GE is a pustule on the fleming legacy
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,401
    Getafix wrote: »
    Mendes4Lyfe wrote: »
    I wouldn't call drowning an "update" on taking pills. If anything it's the reverse, people have been drowning for a lot longer than they having been overdosing, but let's not get macabre. My point is, the way it's portrayed as a split second decision is a betrayal of the Fleming, were Vesper is seen to be suffering for quite some time. They chickened out, in effect. They felt the need to somehow incorporate her death into an action sequence, which didn't even exist in the book.

    Ignoring Fleming altogether isn't as big an insult as taking his story and disregarding parts on a whim. Hence, GE has the upper hand.

    GE is a pustule on the fleming legacy

    Don't see it myself. It's a supreme achievement for the franchise, but not without it's flaws. Could certainly do with 5 minutes being trimmed from the run time.
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