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I don't want people to die. I leave that dark characteristic to "holy crusaders".
No one wants to acknowledge the stark truth that this planet is shockingly overpopulated.
If some people want to reduce numbers through their own idiocy I'm not about to shed a tear.
Glad to know instead of caring for your fellow man you all have embraced the view of evolution to the point of extreme not caring Hugo Drax would be proud
No that's just my opinion. Other atheists may think something totally different but, as usual, a grasp of facts not your strong suit.
Anyway let's point the spotlight at religion which cares for its fellow man by conning poor people out of their money by peddling them futures in a non existent product that their customer can never complain about them not delivering on because said customer will be dead by the time they realise they've been stitched up.
And that's before we start on allowing AIDS to run rampant in Africa, killings, terrorism, noncing kids up and hoarding stolen Jewish gold.
Religion wants to tread very carefully on claiming any moral high ground as it is probably one place behind the Nazis and one ahead of FIFA in the list of most odious organisations ever created by man.
The similarities are unavoidable.
A metophor for certain cultures. They are desperately trying to compete with the West but, at the same time, they just cant rid themselves of fairy tale and myth which drags them back into the dark ages. God knows how much these tickets are but for that price, I want a decent bacon sandwich!!
PS another nuts story:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/feb/09/christians-only-town-bay-view-michigan
"Prospective homeowners, according to a bylaw introduced in 1947 and strengthened in 1986, are required to produce evidence of their faith by providing among other things a letter from a Christian minister testifying to their active participation in a church."
Christian scientist believe the evidence confirms god and the Bible
“Well of course he would say that because he is biased and a Christian so clearly he is wrong”
Atheist Scientist says there is no God and says evidence backs him up
“ clearly he is right I mean he is a scientist after all and there is no bias in his reasoning what a great world of enlightenment we live in”
Right sure completely understandable and logical point of view that is like me polling people who like Quantim of solace and saying it is one of the beloved bond films ever and Wizard only polling people who don’t like Quantum of Solace and saying it is hated
But hey Science right
A mythical being with superpowers or
Faith in the human race to come up with solutions to pur problems. ;-)
Prayer for something as simple as a fruitful harvest doesn't work. Check.
Two things ...... faith or Delusion ;-)
All it takes to say a tautology is to make a tautological statement. No but seriously it depends of the claim. I can believe that your car is red or your wife is blonde without evidence: the claims are not extraordinary and believing them has very little to no consequences. So I'd take your word for it. Now if you tell me you've met Odin Allfather I don't believe you.
Wether I have or not. Fair enough.
And then there's @Risible007 logic.
Your examples are farcical.
The Christian scientist can make any claim he wants if he can back it up. I've said it before that it would be pretty fantastic if when you died you went to heaven instead of rotting in the ground but I've yet to see anything that resembles any kind of proof that wouldn't be laughed out of court. All mankind has ever managed to come up with is a 2000 year old book cobbled together from hearsay from some middle eastern tribes. We're still waiting on the 'evidence' Dragonpol said he was going to provide us with about 2 months ago.
And your statement that an atheist scientist would ever claim that he has evidence that can prove a negative just goes to show how little you understand the scientific method.
Anyone who categorically states that he can prove 100% that there is no God is either an idiot or a liar and no true atheist or scientist would ever make such a claim.
We leave such lapses in logic to the religious.
I saw this video today and it brought me back to a question that I know atheists address here frequently (it is an important one):
That question simply being, what exactly gives religion the right to have the hold on the world it does and why do we have to tiptoe around the religious when taking them to task for their actions and words? Seriously. I can think of no other example outside of religion where something that one believes is not only given such leniency for evidence, substance of argument or credibility and validity, but on top of that provides legal and personal privileges to believers above those who chose not to believe such things.
Taking the message of the video from the root, could you seriously imagine if atheists acted even a fraction like the religious do with their beliefs? For example...
*Atheists would have such a vested interest and place in politics that they could manipulate the law to stop a particular group of people with a certain lifestyle from exercising what would otherwise be a human right without their influence. The religious claim moral ground and a closeness to their precious god for standing against a gay person's simple wish to love who they wish, an irony for sure, but imagine if atheists were so powerful in government that they gave an order such that no religious people could marry because they didn't follow the stark and clarity-ridden reason of the atheist? Naturally, the religious would rebel and cry victim as they always do when their own medicine is supplied to them.
*What if each city or town in the United States or Europe had a center for Atheistic teaching that was exempt from taxes and had a central headquarters in a larger European country or American state that was treated like its own separate entity free of the rules of any other locations? On top of these rampant privileges, what if a scandal came out that those teaching atheism were actively assaulting the children in their midst and the heads of the Atheistic center were hiding this fact from the public, a population of believers who wouldn't believe the claims made regardless of whether such a scandal was exposed with evidence of that fact?
I'm sure that if even a small group of atheists practicing their beliefs were found to be fondling children Christians would use that isolated incident to call out the "inherent immorality" of every atheist, their lack of faith and how being an atheist not only corrupts your sense of right and wrong, but makes you more likely to touch kids with no supreme ruler crowding your shoulder and putting you right with fear and guilt. But because it's more often the religiously involved that lead immoral scandals and religion is somehow exempt from the same criticism and judgement that we impose upon everything in this world, it's not made as big a deal and the followers support the Vatican regardless of how much kid touching is covered up. I'm lucky enough to have a grandmother and aunt who are convinced that priests never touch kids and that the scandal is a big post of nonsense, just to prove this point. When you dull the minds of a public and brainwash them to accept everything in the bible as fact, I guess it's not hard to then ask them to write off child molestation. You've already done much of the work from the moment the first droplets of baptismal water touch their foreheads as infants.
*Additionally, what if atheists mounted equivalent "holy wars" on any who were infidels for not believing their doctrines, inciting violence on innocents in service of their beliefs? As with the marriage and molestation examples, you can bet that the religious would sanctimoniously claim a higher moral ground and call from an eradication of the dangerous belief system of atheism and the coldness with which they treat their faithful opponents. Through propaganda atheism would be considered nothing more than an angry and violent belief system that was a danger to everyone around them, something to be done away with.
*Finally, to wrap this up, what if atheists in America or Europe fought against schools and teachers to get subjects and ideas taught to kids that they wanted spread to the masses while they're young despite those teachings having no intimate relationship with fact, validity or enlightenment? Even if atheists were simply powerful enough to ask that no mention of God be made to kids in classes outside of teaching them about a Godless universe, you could imagine how upset that would make the religious who want evolution struck out and God to be made part of the curriculum in its place. It's okay to circumvent the educational smell test and teach kids unproven nonsense if it has a religious basis to it, but heaven forbid if atheists have the temerity to request more emphasis on fact, applicable ideas and verified hypotheses in class.
All this comes back to the initial point: why such leeway for religion that has nothing special to its name when one objectively looks at it? In what sane society would someone who believes in virgin births, a resurrected messiah and a 6,000 year old earth and who whispers to the sky each night be provided certain privileges or expect more respect or leniency from criticism than everyone else? To avoid generalizing, or someone complaining that I am, I don't mean to equate this to everyone as I know religious people who aren't nutters and who manage to have a sense of morality despite that cobwebbed book (though these people also don't take the bible literally, so they're already more intellectual than serious Christians I've seen).
Without even touching upon the content of religion, its beliefs and expectations, what about anything one believes about anything should give one such rampant freedom from the rules as religion has been given for centuries? What gives religion out of everything the right to hold ransom the human right of marriage and happiness from gays until just two years in the states (this isn't to mention the rest of the world, which still is far too behind in accepting a natural biological development without asking it to hide itself or die out)? What gave the religious of history the right to kill with fire at the stake or exile from view and life those who spoke loud about how full of it their beliefs were just because those dissenters were being honest about the objective, empirical and evidence based findings they'd reached that could've helped unravel the corrupt and misguided schemes the churches were running on the masses? And what exactly gives the religious the right to play victim with their deluded whining about a "war on Christmas" or an ambush on the bible and faith when they have sadly had more power, influence and control that any other entity I can imagine in the world, and still do to many extents, with the keys to governmental offices and the rule of law in addition to the very chains clasped around those the church snaps up when they are young and impressionable?
I would simply love for the religious to spend a day in shoes of those that are truly prosecuted, to feel the kind of senseless and monstrous oppression from freedom that they so claim is at their heels each day with the aforementioned idiotic and shrill screams about a war on Christmas and all the other delusions of adversity they create for themselves out of thin air while others suffer under the silence of their boot heel.
I think I speak for a lot of atheists (and I'm sure those that post here) when I ask for a level playing field of all things. A world where atheists and the religious are placed on the same level and only the weight and merit of their arguments decide who holds more validity, common sense, value of thought or presence of morality, but without either group getting privileges not owned by the other. Because the way the world is now, there is absolutely nothing to warrant the control and influence that religions, especially Catholicism, have on how we live our lives, how the law is dealt out, what women can do with their bodies, who you can love and what we can teach our children. Let's be honest here, after all: being religious doesn't make one more moral or good than any other person who lives without the bible, and in some cases an argument could be made that one lives a more fulfilled and moral life without the holy touch, especially where views on women and the LGBT are concerned because of how infamously the bible has argued against their interests.
It is beyond ridiculous that these issues perpetuated or created by religion still persist and without the presence of religion in the argument (which has somehow earned itself a respect long undeserved), I think most sensible and level-headed people would agree about how ridiculous it is that we are still living in a world where marriage for all is a fresh concept thanks to the homophobia that the bible has most passionately nourished for centuries, where holy wars still have as much relevance as the old Crusades with all of the modern age's scary new weapons of bombs and drones, and where the tools of manipulation and fear are still safely in the laps of the papal brigade, which they impose upon the merry band of followers that happily chain themselves to a belief system on faith and faith alone.
Just venting here, but it's a state of the world that either haunts me or confuses me from day to day. How has the power and influence in the world for centuries now not fallen to those who can use it dispassionately and without irrationality or delusion, but has instead found a home with those who have clung to a book that became outdated by the 4th century. A book and set of beliefs of no merits beyond others that we must all suffer the effects of to this day through any gay friends or family we have, any kids we spawn who should be freed from church sanctioned brainwashing at school and at home, and a system of law and government that should function independent of the influence of any single entity, especially the world's biggest cults. How, how, how?
Very fine post Sir that gets to the very crux of why us atheists on here have to be so vehement.
It's not that we want to stop the religious from being able to believe whatever drivel they wish in their own home. It's the notion that the the whole of society is expected to bend to the will of the religious and their tiresome bleating.
As to how we arrived at such a state of affairs, that, I'm afraid, is, like the Middle East situation, the result of history rippling across generations to affect the future.
For whatever reason, like VHS or alternating current, Christianity managed to become the dominant religion in the civilised world and was able to amass power and influence over the people to the point where it became a virtual monopoly in Europe. And once you have achieved total power we all know that total corruption follows hence some of the disgusting practices of the Vatican over the centuries.
Thankfully religion is finally under the cosh and on the retreat but, being pre eminent for the best part of 2000 years, sadly it's going take many more generations for it to retreat to become an irrelevance and sorry to say that none of us will live to see it disappear but the genie is out of the bottle now and one day we will get to the promised land!
Of course I can only really speak for Christianity in this country. Europe still clings to it more than we do I feel (although an encouraging post about Iceland from someone a few weeks back) and obviously America is a different kettle of fish entirely where it seems there is not very much hope apart from the two coasts.
And then of course there's the elephant in the room - Islam.
So still a long and arduous road to travel chaps but keep fighting the good fight.
Ganesha
All from the one sow's litter, as they say.
Plenty more by Athiests too.
Yeah. But I'm sure that crimes carried out in the name of Atheism (not saying there haven't been any, I'm sure if I googled it I'd be able to find an example of some neckbeard nutjob shooting up a church or something) are few and far between compared to the violence religion has caused.
Yeah the whole Holocost and Pots child revolt not to mention the Russian revolution and chinas communist revolution are few and far between... oh wait no they aren’t and the deaths in any one of these I believe eclipses the crusades...