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https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-charity-investigation-croydon-tabernacle
http://croydontabernacle.org.uk/
Which Quantum mechanics and Quantum Physics proves Materialism is obsolete
Sorry but Lud it requires more faith to believe in Materialism then to be a Christian
I love how you say 32ad why pick that year?
That's the year he was born y'see.
OK I am calling you on it: explain how Quantum mechanics proves materialism obsolete. In the meantime you could give us your definition of materialism to avoid any confusion.
But even IF materialism was indeed proven wrong... so what? That does not prove God. Not all atheists are materialists and depending of the definition of the term not all materialists are atheists.
I'd define materialism (and I don't pretend to have a perfect definition or the only one) as the view that nothing exists outside the material world. Which until we have actual evidence of the contrary is the default position. So far everything we know to exist exists within the physical world.
But atheism and materialism are two completely different things.
https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/is-scientific-materialism-almost-certainly-false/
Anyway, I took a brief pause from this thread to "study" the materialism angle @Risico007 recently brought up. Then I came across this little article, which quite frankly sums up very well, better than I ever could, my thoughts:
https://www.quora.com/Does-quantum-mechanics-disprove-materialism
Oooohhh a link! To an article which titles is a question mark. Hardly the discovery of the atom don't you think?
Just give me the gist of it Ris. Give me YOUR best argument based on YOUR understanding of the terms and EXPLAIN what you know about Quantum physics, materialism and why one debunks the other.
And in the meantime... did you bother reading the article you gave or did you stop at the title?
Indeed.
No one ever claimed science had all the answers. It wouldn't be science if it did that it would be religion.
But even if your back of a fag packet knowledge of Quantum physics irrefutably disproved materialism how does that constitute proof of God?
I fail to see it too. And Ris' article is not exactly Nobel prize material.
However, this tossing into the fire of materialism comes from a disagreement between @Risico007 and myself from a few pages back about God and the resurrection of Jesus. @Risico007 tried to attack my disbelief by claiming that I am stuck in a materialistic world view. Since at least some interpretations of QM may lead -- though it's still speculation, mind -- to the conclusion that such a materialism can be proven obsolete, and since I'm a scientists and therefore a student of QM, then I must somehow abandon my alleged materialism and then I am no longer capable of rejecting God and the resurrection of Christ. Right. A whole lot of logical fallacies there, methinks. It goes a little like this:
"Aliens built the pyramids."
DD: "I'm sorry but I have good reasons to believe aliens have never visited Earth. In fact, simple scientific considerations render the possibility exceptionally small."
"But you are a scientist, and science allows life on other planets far away in our galaxy and other galaxies as a very likely possibility."
DD: "Yes, and your point is?"
"Well, then aliens built the pyramids."
Quite a non-sequitur there.
There is no doubt that quantum physics embodies mind-blowing concepts that force us to question the very nature of reality. And if there’s a contender for our current best “theory of everything” then quantum mechanics wins hands down.
But, far too often, the word “quantum” signals the worst type of vacuous pseudoscientific gobbledegook. It’s exploited by those who are entirely clueless about the underlying physics -- or, worse, should know better -- to evoke a misplaced mysticism about the ‘holistic’ nature of the universe. Moreover, when consciousness and quantum collide, the nonsense factor goes through the roof…
@TheWizardOfIce are you insinuating that he has no idea whatsoever of what he's talking about and used "quantum" as a buzz word hoping it would stick to his claims, that he may not even have bothered to read the article he shared here today or indeed any other he placed in this thread?
You might think that old chap. I couldn't possibly comment.
That's the vibe I've picked up on for several pages now.
Quantum of Solace - see, God does exist!
When you're making Schofield look like Paxman so easy is it for him to batter you and a bloke as nice as Brian Cox says you're talking 'drivel' it's probably time to quit while you're behind.
But of course it's fine to rip the piss out of cranks like these but if Phil was doing that to a group of religious believers he'd be getting smashed on Twitter, probably have a fatwah against him and a fair chance he'd have his collar felt by the old bill. Once again religion is allowed to play by different rules.
Why give these idiots screen time and any kind of exposure?
Why aren't you 'respecting their beliefs'?
Because they aren t going to kill us if we don t.
Song of Praise is downright embarrassing. Out of place and out of time. It's basically C of E propaganda.
SOP is what modern religion should be. A collection of OAPs, do gooders and virgins getting together for a sing song that harms nobody (although don't spend the licence fee on it and put it on BBC1 FFS) and makes them happy.
It's when people - and governments!!!! - in this day and age actually take it seriously and give it respect and privilege that is not extended to other crank beliefs that I take umbrage.