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Have you noticed any bloopers in NTTD?

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  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited February 2022 Posts: 5,970
    Oh Spectre... I don't obviously wanna take away from the specific discussion, but what was M's plan here? She's dead, tells Bond to not miss the funeral of someone he hasn't even found, let alone killed, which means what exactly? Sure, he meets his widow and she leads him to a SPECTRE meeting, but she didn't know there would be a meeting? I know his widow would be an obvious lead, but for all M knows she could in on it too or dead even? Incredibly convoluted but I guess we're talking about Spectre.

    But yeah the whole timing thing is so confusing, despite it being something you can just ignore, although the idea that Quantum is set in 2008 is the most confusing part.
  • ImpertinentGoonImpertinentGoon Everybody needs a hobby.
    Posts: 1,351
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Oh Spectre... I don't obviously wanna take away from the specific discussion, but what was M's plan here? She's dead, tells Bond to not miss the funeral of someone he hasn't even found, let alone killed, which means what exactly? Sure, he meets his widow and she leads him to a SPECTRE meeting, but she didn't know there would be a meeting? I know his widow would be an obvious lead, but for all M knows she could in on it too or dead even? Incredibly convoluted but I guess we're talking about Spectre.

    But yeah the whole timing thing is so confusing, despite it being something you can just ignore, although the idea that Quantum is set in 2008 is the most confusing part.

    It’s one of those situations where they have the cool idea to have the „M briefing“ deconstructed into being by Dead-Dench via video and went with it and then they yada-yada the rest of the logic of it and it doesn’t hold up to scrutiny. SP has a couple of those.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 41,009
    Denbigh wrote: »
    But yeah the whole timing thing is so confusing, despite it being something you can just ignore, although the idea that Quantum is set in 2008 is the most confusing part.

    Crazy how that would be quashed if not for the date on the fundraiser invitations.
  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 2,641
    ImpertinentGoon wrote: »
    Interesting point made on twitter:

    Bond says in NTTD that M had Obruchev working on Heracles for 10 years. That’s 5 years after the PTS, which we assume is months or weeks, not years, after the end of SP. Mallory has only been M since the end of SF, which in real life was 3 years prior to SP, which means he would only have been leading MI6 for 8 years at that point.

    I don’t recall the exact quote from the film, but I’m pretty sure it is made clear that Mallory was the one who brought in Valdo, not Mansfield. Most likely, Bond is just rounding up, it could also be that SF and SP were kn fact further apart than we thought, but it is still most likely a script inaccuracy.

    I always assumed SP took place months if not a year after Skyfall. At least relatively soon, there's so many links to Skyfall it would be odd if it was many years later.

    I'm always intrigued at how many years were between Quantum and Skyfall. 6 maybe? Given that Quantum takes place an hour after Casino and Vesper died in 2006, according to her tomb in NTTD
  • ImpertinentGoonImpertinentGoon Everybody needs a hobby.
    Posts: 1,351
    I think that was the original question that prompted the observation on twitter: Basically someone should sit down and do a timeline of the Craig era.

    The problem is that it just doesn't fit together.

    Vesper died in 2006. We assume the end of CR is not very long after that and the QoS PTS is only shortly - a day at the very most - later. But then the film later jumps to 2008 without any apparent time passing:
    invitation.jpg
    It's pretty small print, but Greene's party in La Paz takes place on 23 August 2008.
    Now that is obviously just a production oversight, but still: it's in the film!

    Next thing is the jump from QoS to SF. Someone would have to go through SF with a finetooth comb to see if there are any dates on screen, but the big story point is of course that Bond is washed. This has been discussed to death, but it really doesn't seem like it could only have been 4 years since the end of QoS. So if we go completely crazy and say there were 8 years between those two films and SF is actually in 2016 and then SP follows very closely, NTTD now puts and endcap on that due to my original post: By the time of NTTD, Mallory has been M for somewhere around 10 years (even if Bond rounds up). So NTTD is something like 2024?

    At the end of the day, it just doesn't fit together and I am mad at myself for thinking too hard about it.

    Less facts, more vibes. And the vibes are impeccable.
  • fadetoblack7fadetoblack7 Chicago IL
    Posts: 60
    Apologies if this has been discussed already, but why didn’t Primo die in the Cuba sequence? He was a Spectre agent after all…
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited February 2022 Posts: 5,970
    fadetoblack7 wrote: »
    Apologies if this has been discussed already, but why didn’t Primo die in the Cuba sequence? He was a Spectre agent after all…
    I'd say its because he's a henchman or mercenary. It would seem only high-ranking members of the organisation had their DNA on file. Everyone who survived was either a dancer or a gun for hire. Remember all those henchmen that Paloma and Bond fought weren't affected either.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    edited February 2022 Posts: 41,009
    fadetoblack7 wrote: »
    Apologies if this has been discussed already, but why didn’t Primo die in the Cuba sequence? He was a Spectre agent after all…

    That's a good question. My only guess would be he was far away enough from the mist that it didn't affect him. It didn't look that way, though. It could be that Primo wasn't considered high up enough in the organization to warrant targeting, despite how integral he was to being Blofeld's eye on the outside, literally.
  • fadetoblack7fadetoblack7 Chicago IL
    Posts: 60
    Ahh that makes sense. Thanks!
  • MalloryMallory
    Posts: 2,171
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    fadetoblack7 wrote: »
    Apologies if this has been discussed already, but why didn’t Primo die in the Cuba sequence? He was a Spectre agent after all…

    That's a good question. My only guess would be he was far away enough from the mist that it didn't affect him. It didn't look that way, though. It could be that Primo wasn't considered high up enough in the organization to warrant targeting, despite how integral he was to being Blofeld's eye on the outside, literally.

    I think there is a bit cut from the cuba sequence, where Primo chases Bond and Paloma after the gas attack.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    Posts: 5,970
    The only response I have to why would Primo is not considered high-ranking even though he's literally Blofeld's eye, is that he's a man on the ground and probably to Blofeld incredibly expendable. If Primo died, he'd just get someone else to take their eye out I imagine...
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,902
    I took it as Primo's lower rank not warranting killing with the rest of Spectre. Even if he wasn't in the mist, those nanobots would catch up with him if he was targeted--wrestling with 007 for example.

    Still another possibility is Safin had Valdo include him out by design, seeing him as a useful recruit.. That's the utility and targeting ability of the nanobots.

  • ImpertinentGoonImpertinentGoon Everybody needs a hobby.
    Posts: 1,351
    RichardTheBruce wrote: »
    I took it as Primo's lower rank not warranting killing with the rest of Spectre. Even if he wasn't in the mist, those nanobots would catch up with him if he was targeted--wrestling with 007 for example.

    Still another possibility is Safin had Valdo include him out by design, seeing him as a useful recruit.. That's the utility and targeting ability of the nanobots.

    It could also be a safety precaution on Valdo/Safin's side. Primo is the one who carries the vial to the distributing mechanism and sets the whole thing up. If there is any problem and he gets into contact with the stuff earlier than planned, the plan would be blown by him dying horrifically. That is very thin reasoning and the other reasons brought up are better, but not impossible, I think.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited February 2022 Posts: 5,970
    RichardTheBruce wrote: »
    Still another possibility is Safin had Valdo include him out by design, seeing him as a useful recruit.. That's the utility and targeting ability of the nanobots.
    ImpertinentGoon wrote: »
    It could also be a safety precaution on Valdo/Safin's side. Primo is the one who carries the vial to the distributing mechanism and sets the whole thing up. If there is any problem and he gets into contact with the stuff earlier than planned, the plan would be blown by him dying horrifically. That is very thin reasoning and the other reasons brought up are better, but not impossible, I think.
    Both great points!
  • AstonLotusAstonLotus
    Posts: 1,394
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 41,009
    I haven't seen those "Cinema Sins" in ages, for good reason. I thought they died off.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,574
    Yeah they are terrible.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 41,009
    mtm wrote: »
    Yeah they are terrible.

    Incredibly.
  • BondAficionadoBondAficionado Former IMDBer
    Posts: 1,890
    ImpertinentGoon wrote: »
    I think that was the original question that prompted the observation on twitter: Basically someone should sit down and do a timeline of the Craig era.

    The problem is that it just doesn't fit together.

    Vesper died in 2006. We assume the end of CR is not very long after that and the QoS PTS is only shortly - a day at the very most - later. But then the film later jumps to 2008 without any apparent time passing:
    invitation.jpg
    It's pretty small print, but Greene's party in La Paz takes place on 23 August 2008.
    Now that is obviously just a production oversight, but still: it's in the film!

    Next thing is the jump from QoS to SF. Someone would have to go through SF with a finetooth comb to see if there are any dates on screen, but the big story point is of course that Bond is washed. This has been discussed to death, but it really doesn't seem like it could only have been 4 years since the end of QoS. So if we go completely crazy and say there were 8 years between those two films and SF is actually in 2016 and then SP follows very closely, NTTD now puts and endcap on that due to my original post: By the time of NTTD, Mallory has been M for somewhere around 10 years (even if Bond rounds up). So NTTD is something like 2024?

    At the end of the day, it just doesn't fit together and I am mad at myself for thinking too hard about it.

    Less facts, more vibes. And the vibes are impeccable.

    I'll definitely be making a comprehensive timeline for Craig's era in the next month or so. I just don't have the time to research and design one at the moment. But if anyone here already knows about an online tool where we can all contribute to it, then by all means start and I'd be happy to join later on!
  • Since62Since62
    Posts: 1,650
    Veddddy interesting. It's too bad they showed any dates in QOS at all. I like the traditional approach where there are no dates in particular. Certainly, a few things may indicate dates or timeframes...the stolen painting in DR, the model years of cars, the Mujahadin being in a particular posture in TLD, but, generally, they've avoided specifics.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,359
    CR had references to 2006 on the video from the Ocean Club.

    I don't know about SF.
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