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What, by 2 points? Sheesh! :)>-
DR NO is a largely realistic film…until the good Doctor himself, and his island hideout, are presented to the audience. At this point, we have a mad scientist as our villain…and mad scientists are indisputably the stuff of science fiction. While the Doctor’s methods, and his intent, are realistically portrayed, we still have a strong element of the fantastic in this storyline…not least of which are the Doctor’s artificial hands. Does anybody stop to question the real world application of these appendages? Nope. They are simply taken for granted. I will suggest that Dr. No could make more money marketing prosthetic devices such as these to the world medical community than he will ever make working for SPECTRE…and grade this film as an example of FANTASTIC REALISM in the Bond canon. The element of the fantastic is certainly there, but the story at its core is a fairly realistic one.
FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE is one of the most realistic of all the Bond films, with the element of the fantastic primarily couched in the creation of SPECTRE itself. While nefarious groups of this type have become a staple of what we might call “Spyfi,” we would do well to remember that this film provided the first real glimpse of such a group in cinematic history. Whether the true creator of SPECTRE was Fleming, McClory, Whittingham, or some unknowable combination thereof, the fact remains: Thrush and the rest are all the offspring of SPECTRE. They are a great leap forward from the reality of the Mafia into the realm of the fantastic, and they are a far more suitable menace for the likes of James Bond to face than anything we have since seen. Quantum only wishes they could be as cool as SPECTRE. Maybe some day they will be, but that day hasn’t arrived just yet. I’ll call this film a straight out example of REALISM in the Bond series …and remind one and all that in Fleming’s novel, “Red” Grant (who is never identified as more than “Grant” in the movie) is described as being unnaturally sensitive to the phases of the moon insofar as his lust for killing is concerned. It seems to me that he is very nearly lycanthropic in that regard, and that for Fleming’s purposes, “Red” Grant is a far more supernatural figure in the novel than Robert Shaw’s portrayal of the character is allowed to be.
GOLDFINGER can only be considered a REALISTIC FANTASY of a film. The villain’s plot is one giveaway, of course. He is unconcerned with the niceties of conventional espionage; instead, his intent is to cause the financial ruination of the United States, and to increase his own wealth substantially, by irradiating the gold supply cached at Fort Knox. The film makes a valiant effort at increasing the believability of Fleming’s basic plot…while Fleming’s Goldfinger actually did intend to steal all the gold in Fort Knox, Connery’s Bond enunciates the implausibility of this scheme by calculating the amount of time that would be involved in actually moving all that gold. No matter, the fantasy element of this film is brought fully to the fore by the mere existence of Oddjob. Here we have the first of the nearly superhuman adversaries to face Bond in the movies (Grant is a mere human in comparison) and Oddjob is one of the most fascinating characters in the film. He is stronger than any normal human being, nearly invulnerable, equipped with a deadly, cartoonish bowler hat…and completely unexplained. How did he get so strong? Is he a mutant? Was he bitten by a radioactive brick wall? Does he, like Popeye, get his unnatural powers from eating something surprising (in his case, some exotic variation on the otherwise inedible Korean dish known as kimchi?) Where did he get his razor edged bowler? It doesn’t matter. Oddjob doesn’t have an origin and he doesn’t need one. He is Oddjob, a creature of the fantastic, and his presence in Goldfinger is part of what defines this film.
THUNDERBALL is a film that sits precisely at the intersection of Realism and the Fantastic. The villains’ plot (which is generally a strong indication of any given film’s realism factor) is totally in the realm of the fantastic. Blackmail the western powers by stealing a pair of atomic bombs? One could easily put this in the same class as GOLDFINGER…and yet, the film takes exceptional care at establishing the villains’ plot as entirely within the realm of believability. The nightmare of atomic bombs in the wrong hands has been of great concern to both the East and the West for many decades now, and this film makes that nightmare all too real. The elements of the fantastic in this story are primarily in the coincidences that Fleming took for granted in his plotting. Bond just happens to be in attendance at a spa that also houses bad guys in the middle of setting up their devious plot? Sure, why not? Bond gets a glimpse of a photo that shows the both missing plane’s pilot AND his gorgeous sister, and Bond immediately concludes that this sister is his strongest lead to the stolen bombs? Well, of course! Happens all the time! If not for the outrageous coincidences in this film, I might argue for it to be considered as entirely realistic…as things stand, I’ll call it another example of FANTASTIC REALISM, and move on to the next film in the canon…
YOU ONLY LIVE TWICE can only be considered the first of the entirely FANTASTIC entries in the Bond series. Space capsules being hijacked in orbit, swallowed whole and returned to Earth by a Spectre spaceship? An island hideout hidden in a dormant volcano? A car being lifted aloft by a helicopter dangling a magnet…and the whole scene being viewed by Bond on a tiny television screen in another car WITHOUT THERE BEING A CAMERA ANYWHERE IN THE VICINITY OF THE FIRST CAR TO CAPTURE THE SCENE IN QUESTION HERE??? Let’s not even get into the plastic surgery designed to make Bond appear Japanese, the results of which totally disappear by the time Bond is captured and held by Blofeld inside the astonishing Ken Adams hideout. I’m sorry, but reality went totally out the window with this movie. It’s an enjoyable enough film, no question here, but there is not an iota of realism anywhere to be found here.
Are the parameters of this exercise suitably established by this time? I hope so. I’ll return later with a continuation of this examination in a bit…in the meanwhile, I hope I’ve sparked some thoughts (and perhaps even some conversations) from the rest of my fellows!
Just sayin'.
It's time to switch to Most Unrealistic Bond Films.
Are there any? Oh I think so ... ;) Elements of DAD, YOLT, and Moonraker are just cying out for acknowledgement it seems.
If you would like to rank your most realistic Bond films, please continue to do so. And thanks, @CrabKey for your comment on the way you view realism. As a general rule of what is "realistic" I agree with you.
For the Most Realistic Bond films, I will be tallying up those results in 2 days. For now, let's move on to Most Unrealistic Bond Films (which includes fantasy, implausible things happening, etc.)
You don't have to use the same categories unless you'd like to, in which case please do. But let's also just give examples and discuss this issue of things being too farfetched in Bond films.
Let's have some fun with discussing the opposite end of the spectrum now for a few days.
Cheers!
(I'm going for the most unrealistic Bond film, but I'll still be ranking it on realism, so obviously this time around it'll be the lower score = the more unrealistic it is.)
Bond's Capabilities - 3.5 out of 5. Given everything at Bond's disposal throughout the film, I wouldn't say what he does is unrealistic by a far margin. The one thing that stands out to me would be him getting a helicopter out of the back of an airplane and starting it up in the nick of time like he does. Also, of course, the CGI parasailing; whether it was real or not, doing all of that and holding on to every component to create the parasail before this huge tsunami happens is so far-fetched, and I can see this example cropping up a lot for anyone else who votes.
Villain's Main Aims - 0 out of 5. Completely change your accent, race, background, establish yourself as a higher-up in less than 14 months AND create an ice palace and a massive space weapon powered by diamonds, just to destroy the 38th Parallel? Well!
Weapons And Gadgets/Transport - 2.5 out of 5. He surfs, uses machine guns, a homing beacon, C4 with diamonds, and a hovercraft in the PTS. That's all plausible. Continuing on throughout the rest of the film, it all seems very realistic, but that perfectly capable invisible car and his whole parasail mock-up in a matter of a minute heavily removes some points for me, as the DB5 is his main transport in the film.
Villain's Capabilities - 1 out of 5. Again, the villain is capable of changing from a Korean to this well-established, multi-talented, famous, knighted British fencing master in 14 months? He also has some electrical exo-suit and "groovy" gene therapy equipment. His henchmen are severely lacking, so his capabilities are essentially brought down to unrealistic territories.
Portrayal Of The World Or Situation That Bond Finds Himself In - 4 out of 5. This is probably the most generous I'll end up being for DAD. North and South Korea are fighting against one another. That's realistic and plausible. The situation, however, involves someone who has completely changed himself, with plans to destroy the DMZ in Korea. That's plausible, but his means to do so aren't.
Escapes And Chases - 1.5 out of 5. The only ones that come to mind are the hovercraft and possibly the Zao vs. Bond ice chase. Maybe the foot chase in Cuba? That's really it. Taking off in a speeding bullet car to outrun a diamond-charged space weapon, just to CGI parasail away from a tsunami, then to return to the ice palace and use invisibility to stop the bad guy and save the girl? Then you get to the airplane, where he flings the helicopter out of the airplane and miraculously starts it up (all in glorious CGI...not) before it hits the ground. No.
Fights - 2 out of 5. The fist fight in the clinic seems plausible, but when the magnetic machine gets turned on and all the sharp tools fly by without even touching Zao? Please. The sword fight in the club is a bit sped up, but that's still realistic to me. Brutal, gritty, one of my favorite scenes in the movie. The laser fight scene is horrible and unrealistic to me, as is the finale fight with the exosuit. Terribly done and incredibly cheesy.
Finale And Resolution Of The Story - 0 out of 5. The finale is too unrealistic for me, MP has a VR sequence where she makes out with Bond (one of the biggest sins in DAD), and Bond and Jinx wheel in that huge case of diamonds to...stuff them in her belly button? *sigh*
Total: 14.5 out of 40. Whew. And that's me being generous in some areas, I believe. I really don't see that being topped.
~ Bond's capabilities: 3.5/5. Nothing too wrong, but the collective silliness of some of the other categories take their toll.
~ Villain's main aims: 5/5 Gaining a monopoly on the heroin trade? Nothing wrong here.
~ Weapons and gadgets/transport (including vehicles, methods of transport): 4/5. Nothing really stands out. The shark gun isn't implausible on its face, and points were taken off below for Dr. Kananga's death. Loses points for not explaining the watch razor.
~ Villain's capabilities (physical, mental, influence on others, wealth/assets, etc.): 1/5 Sorry, Dr. Kananga, having a virgin fortune teller and a voodoo god is just a bridge too far.
~ Portrayal of the world or situation that Bond finds himself in: 2/5. In my dad's words, "Every black person in the world is in on it!"
~ Escapes and chases: 2/5. There's nothing particularly egregious about the car chase in Manhattan, the plane escapade, the crocodile run, and the boat chase, but altogether they take their toll.
~ Fights: 3.5/5. The fight with Tee-Hee is a little silly, but nothing too bad.
~ Finale and resolution of the story: 2/5. Dr. Kananga's explosion kind of dooms this category.
23/40. Not as bad as the worst offenders, but hardly a paragon of realism.
@Chris, you have caught me in an overstatement. Yes, I bought Little Nellie too. I keep her in the garage and take her out for a spin every other Sunday. If you'll excuse me, there's a volcano out in the Bay that needs exploring. Be seeing you! :-\"
And it saddens me to say that film is MR. Why I am saddened, you ask? Because I love MR; I think it's a beautiful film, both in terms of image and music, as well as a technical marvel. But when your villain puts a space station in orbit without anyone knowing about it, suspension of disbelief doesn't help a bit against a whole array of logistical issues.
In truth, Bond villains have pulled some remarkable tricks before. For example, SPECTRE equips a volcano to where it can hold a space rocket launcher and... a landing platform. Yes, these rockets are remarkably easy to put down and re-use. One wonders why NASA never managed to do this.
One of the worst things though is Scaramanga's island. He targets Gibson, steals the Solex and the next day his island has a fully equipped mega-installation for trapping solar power. It must take years to develop and then build something like this, yet absolutely nothing in the story indicates that our paid assassin commissioned dozens of engineers and hundreds of technicians to do this. Never mind the fact that as far as MI6 is concerned, Gibson's Solex is a brand new piece of technology, a prototype of sorts. It makes absolutely no sense that our man with the golden gun manages to produce, in seemingly no time, a large-scale installation based on revolutionary technology that has just awoken from the stage of theoretical infancy. That's like Becquerel discovering alpha and beta rays today and Japan being nuked tomorrow. It took roughly forty years to get there. (And it's a sad thing they ever got there at all, but this is not the right thread for that.)
Even with TMWTGG giving me a hard time in the "makes sense" department, MR tops it all. One private contractor builds half a dozen space shuttles and has the equipment to actually launch them, almost simultaneously one might add. He must have done that a hundred times before, by the way, unless that space shuttle flew into orbit all by itself. It took half the world an incredibly expensive joint-venture and several decades to achieve something like that, and then still the ISS is but a sliver of nothingness compared to Drax' space station. The only logical explanation for it would be that Drax is in cahoots with the Romulans a century before First Contact. That or E.T.'s pals parked there three years before the little bugger got left behind on our planet.
IMO, DAD is positively realistic on the level of "it could happen to you" when compared to MR.
We reach! :)
Although DAD is loaded with crazy, farfetched things (the change of face, gene therapy gets me the most) ... surely one of the most fantastical and unrealistic Bond films is Moonraker. Maybe I'll let it tie with DAD for me. ;) I'll ponder that. What I found most interesting is your look at Scaramanga's island. I simply had not considered the timing of it before. You make it so clear. What a fantasy island that is indeed. The YOLT landing pad for the rocket is amusing. Perhaps they were just being optimistic. ;)
And @soundofthesinners, I had not thought of LALD first for unrealistic Bond films, but you made some good points.
I'm off for work soon, but please continue to post your thoughts on the most unrealistic Bond films. Feel free to mention just certain scenes in films or rate a whole film.
Have fun! :>
I am going to select License to Kill as one of the most realistic of all of the Bond films. Drug empires were at their height in the late 80s. Say what you will about and Miami Vice and Scarface parallels, but the drug epidemic, especially its cartels, and not communism was the worst threat of its time. LTK was loosely based on the Medellin Cartel with Pablo Escobar (Franz Sanchez) as its leader.
~ Bond's capabilities: LTK was the first that we've seen Bond go rogue. Bond went to Felix's wedding. Felix captured Sanchez. Felix and Della got married, but the honeymooooon, let's just say did not go as planned. Rather than go to his assignment in Istanbul, Bond stayed in the Florida Keys to help his friend. Because of his loyalty to Felix, Bond resigned from MI6. Bond only had his wits, a few million, contact Pam Bouvier and ole Uncle Q on holiday to rely on. Still, Bond managed to infiltrate Sanchez's empire and ultimately destroy it. Anyone who manages to pull this off without backing from MI6 earns a 5 in my book. (5)
~ Villain's main aims: Sanchez's main aim was to expand his empire to the Pacific. He would have gotten away with it to if it weren't for that meddling Bond. Can't blame a drug lord for wanting to expand his empire. (4)
~ Weapons and gadgets/transport (including vehicles, methods of transport): Bond needed Pam's help to get to Isthmus (though reluctant at first). Uncle Q turned out to be a pretty good harbor craft pilot. Not so much Pam and Krest though. Those tankers, what a waste...of drug money. Q provided minimalist, yet effective gadgets to give Bond a clear shot at Sanchez with his signature gun. Compared to previous, and future Bond film, less is better. (5)
~ Villain's capabilities (physical, mental, influence on others, wealth/assets, etc.): Many of us on here put Sanchez among the villain elite. and with good reason. Sanchez was arguably the most brutal main villain of the franchise. Came all the way out of hiding, just to make a point to Lupe's other lover. Sanchez would get caught, but not before showing Lupe her boyfriend's heart. Sanchez made shark dinner out of Felix's legs and ordered the most horrible death in the franchise's history for Della. Krest's OTT head explosion and Heller's forklift impalement are further examples of Sanchez's brutality. Needless to say, others would think twice before going after Sanchez, thus giving Sanchez a huge psychological advantage. Sanchez's vast fortunes were very influential on turncoat DEA agent Killifer and Isthmus el Presidente Hector Lopez (Bad Son!). Sanchez did reward loyalty though. (5)
~ Portrayal of the world or situation that Bond finds himself in: Again the drug problem of the 80s was captured in LTK. Have nothing to really add to what I've already said. (5)
~ Escapes and chases: Bond manages to escape those dastardly MI6 henchmen, the WaveKrest, Sanchez's mansion, the mediation retreat, and the tankers. The tanker chase is considered one of the greatest chases in franchise history. The initial capture of Sanchez was good as well. (4)
~ Fights: Lots of them. Let's start with the main event mano y mano. Not just regular fisticuffs, but axes, gasoline, and Felix's lighter made for a great final showdown. Bond and Dario in a great fight to avoid to coke grinder. Bond avenges Felix by making Hillifer the sharks next meal. Bond wasn't as successful with the Hong Kong Narc folks though. (4)
~ Finale and resolution of the story: Bond proved he didn't need no steenkin' MI6 badges to take down Sanchez's empire. Felix wants to go fishing. Bond chooses his shag for the night at Sanchez's old estate, gets his tux wet, but keeps his martini dry. Q has a double as a fish blinks at us. Yep, the blinking fish cost this round a 5. (4)
36/40. By far, LTK was the most violent film in the franchise. Can't blame Timothy for not wanting to take his kids to see this. Still, LTK is IMHO the most underrated film of the franchise. Great action, great Bond, great villain, great henchman, great realistic storyline and effects and in only one instance, LTK was over the top (Krest in the decompression chamber. LTK is considered low on the humor end, but it has some excellent dark humor. The realism in LTK probably wasn't too far off in the drug cartel world.
Silly silly British man. ;;)
I so agree with you about LTK. Yes, the winking fish was rather just too out of character for this film. This film overall was drenched with realism.
@FoxRox
You are spot on regarding DAF and DAD and MR. I don't agree in regards to TMWTGG and AVTAK. I would excuse these two films but would gladly add YOLT to your list.
Like@Chrisisall comments regarding MR, there is no way thanks to satellite survelleilance that SPECTRE could launch their rogue rocket. And the costs would be astronomical. Expect us to believe that they could dig out that mountain in Japan and build all that shytt without being noticed if not by the Japanese authorities (Where the heck was Tanaka during all these shenagians?)?? Or US or Soviet surveillance, huh? Help me out here.
Also SPECTRE would have collapsed thanks to its operative's expense accounts. Why would Olga crash a plane to kill Bond when she could have shot him when she had him tied up in her cabin? maybe that is why she was killed for misuse of corporate funds.
Maybe I'm being too harsh on YOLT but it is where Bond of the sixties really flew off the rails. Looking at the other spy films of the day, YOLT was in keeping with the crap. And this is the main thing I take offense with regarding MR (and TSWLM to a degree). A throwback to the OTT spy films of the sixties.
DAD as well IMO.
How did you arrive at that number my friend? Is that $400 billion in 1979 or today?
In todays $.
And did you put your little finger to your mouth when you said it? ;-)
Muhuhuhahaha....
http://www.mi6community.com/index.php?p=/discussion/2689/controversial-opinions-about-bond-films#latest
In the meantime, please do round out our discussion of the most unrealistic Bond film. I'm enjoying reading your thoughts, even though I cannot always post a reply in a timely manner.
For me, Moonraker, DAD, YOLT, and TMWTGG make my unrealistic list. I was disappointed when I saw TMWTGG in the theaters, and it has not risen in my estimation since then. Moonraker was so over the top buffoonery, it rather takes the big fake Too FarFetched Award, in my opinion. The Bondola alone made me gag, let alone the entire outer space fiasco. Lovely music, though. :)
Hard to believe not more people have posted their feelings about DAD as far as this topic is concerned. And DarthDimi is right about Moonraker, I feel. Does anyone consider Octopussy very unrealistic? How about just looking at the stunts ... which were truly unrealistic?
Anyway, carry on, folks! :>
Sorry! (I know it will all get evened out eventually ...)