It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
^ Back to Top
The MI6 Community is unofficial and in no way associated or linked with EON Productions, MGM, Sony Pictures, Activision or Ian Fleming Publications. Any views expressed on this website are of the individual members and do not necessarily reflect those of the Community owners. Any video or images displayed in topics on MI6 Community are embedded by users from third party sites and as such MI6 Community and its owners take no responsibility for this material.
James Bond News • James Bond Articles • James Bond Magazine
Comments
It's not because the first part is bad, just because I was talking about the Bond theme in that track.
Arnold did this as well. There's a lot of cues of Surrender (listen to Backseat Driver or White Knight, for example), of The World Is Not Enough song (the casino track, Come in 007, Your Time is Up, Welcome to Baku) and of the awful Another Way To Die (Pursuit at Porte Au Prince). The melody of You Know My Name constituted the whole score of Casino Royale. The only movie which didn't feautre the song melody was Die Another Day, as Arnold refused to use it, and can you seriously blame him for that?
Kamen, Serra and Newman didn't do that (Newman did, but only because he was forced by the producers, and he just did a really subtle reference in one track)
I agree that Nobody does it better is a wonderful song, but that's it.
For Your Eyes Only is not that good. Not bad either, but nothing awesome. Again, that's just one melody.
Ladies First sucks. It's not even music, it's pure shit. The rest you mentioned, though, is pretty good.
"Just hardcore fans know his music", yeah, that's what the world is supposed to be. If you like his music, it's because you're his fan, not because you hear his music everywhere (like they do with famous (most of the times shitty) songs, like Gangnam style, or Waka Waka, or Hello).
To me, Arnold uses the Bond theme when he runs out of ideas.
As for not using Madonna's song in his score. More like his ego talking here than anything else as I have read his comments on Madonna's song (which admittedly not the best but at least it was different and the lyrics of the song and the song can be interpreted from the point of view of Bond, JInx or the three villains).
If Martin and Barry can transform a pop/rock themes like Live and Let Die like A View to A Kill into romantic arrangement, why can't Arnold with Die Another Day? To me, that is the hallmark of a lesser talent...slagging off someone else's work when you both are working on the same film like a petulant child.
That is not it. At least Hamlisch composed a score around the song, and a score that is identifiable and cohesive. Even his rather dated Bond 77 action theme is recognizable and was used throughout the movie. Perhaps you should differentiate Hamlish's released commercial soundtrack as opposed to what was actually use in the movie.
And Bill Conti scored only one film and made the most of that opportunity and composed a world-famous song and again, a recognizable and identifiable score. What have Arnold done? He squanders his chance again and again.
And that is why Arnold's score are mediocre and lesser works for the most part.
A couple of weaks back i have seen Save House.
Composed by Ramin Djawadi (40), German/Iran composer living in America who also did Ask the Dust (QOS, Skyfall and Bond 24 production Dennis Gassner work also on that movie.) and the first Iron Man movie and has experience with some animated movies too. Include animated movie from Belgium. I think because of his work for Iron Man, Warner ask him last year for Pacific Rim. His first works in VS be under Hans Zimmer include some work on Batman Begins.
Interview & selection of clips from movies he composed:
Iron Man
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-9xmevqHu0
Safe House
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_OtaH4nmyOI
Die Another Day is a techno song with no identifiable notes that can be pulled from the chorus, for one thing. I'm sure Barry would have had a hard time doing anything with it too. That's why the only time it appears in the film is as a lyric-less version. You can't quote techno like you can rock or ballad.
Funnily enough, the things you're saying about Arnold are things that Barry did on numerous occasions too. He made no secret that he disliked Lulu's The Man with the Golden Gun and Aha's The Living Daylights.
Not a strong argument.
Neither did Newman according to most musicfans, they suspected him of not bringing his A-game.
The best argument for bringing in a new composer is that while EON took the franchise into a new direction, it should do so musically as well. I want to be impressed with a new spectacular soundtrack and sound for 007 the next generation. Star Trek managed that as well, so what is stopping EON with their franchise????
Not a good comparison considering that he wrote The Man With the Golden Gun and co-wrote The Living Daylights.
A better comparison is George Martin. He did not write Live And Let Die and yet incorporate it into his score.
Granted Tomorrow Never Dies have some moments and I considered Casino Royale the best of his soundtracks for Bond.
There is no excuse for the sonic mess that is The World Is Not Enough when he actually co-wrote the title song with veteran Don Black.
Actually that isn't a comparison as Martin produced Live & Let Die. That's why he was able to incorporate it into his score.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gFatKdnyB4
I'm fine with Newman, Desplat, Giacchino or Armstrong as well.
And for the guess who still mourn and sob for Barry, the man is no more, even in his later life he was estranged from the franchise, and there never will be Johnz Barrz scoring Bond movies. It's a fact.
You must be joking. This standing the test of time?
I've heard repeatedly that he's past his best on here, but it seems a shame that one of the best composers of recent years has never been given a crack at Bond. He couldn't do a less inspired insipid than Newman managed, surely. The SF score was one of the blandest and least memorable in the entire history of the series. Not bad, just earth crushingly dull.
I didn't love the SF soundtrack (I felt it was a decent score) but I agree with the rest of your post. Newman never made any nice sounding, catchy slow cues like Arnold does though which I missed in SF but overall, I think Newman did a better job.
Am I a big DA fan? Umm no ..I think the series has changed and we knew a new sound. Newman was probably a better talent but umm eh it was okay.. sounded too much like DA lol. Mendes likes Newman... compares to old suspense thriller composers ..
Anyway everyone has an opinion just good or not still hate to see an actual Bond fan bashed so much.
Remember we wouldn't have the DC era without the series revival by the PB folks... grant it Craig has the better overall talent working on these films but still...
Okay I said my peace :)
He improved during the Craig run and did some good work on CR and QoS, but he has to raise his game. He knows how to do it (his cue during the Opera scene in Austria in QoS is pure Bond masterclass and worthy of the franchise) but too often his scoring is like something for a stupid TV show.
Remember you are working on the greatest movie franchise damnit!
Otherwise, bring back Newman. He at least seems to have respect for the franchise. His work on Skyfall was very memorable, modern and fresh. The Shanghai stuff was absoutely 'A' grade material and not derivative of anything.
Respect for the franchise? You mean the guy who couldn't be arsed to used the Bond theme in the film that's celebrating its 50 year history (and I don't count that pittance of the theme when the DBV is revealed)?
Thomas Newman's work on Skyfall was bland and generic.
At least David Arnold's scores are more distinctive.
The casual music listener and younger audiences know and love Zimmer, and I'm willing to bet 90% of people can recognise Zimmer's "Time" instantly. Bond needs to bring back soundtracks that people want to download. I listen to Newman's score religiously, and the more I hear it, the more I see how bland it is.
This was part of the 'dial back' of the cliches that surrounded the Brosnan tenure (badly written one liners, overuse of Bond theme for any action sequence, gadgets galore from the Omega, Bond James Bond used to death, Shaken not Stirred etc. etc.).
Regarding his work being bland and generic compared to Arnold (particularly Arnold during TWINE and DAD), let's just agree to disagree shall we.
A producer directive? Source?
It is quite apparent that Thomas Newman did not bring his A game to Skyfall. He did not even use Adele's superb Skyfall in the score properly, all we got was breadcrumbs.
It was appropriate not to include the Bond theme in Casino Royale: that is pretty obvious. Quantum of Solace is a whole different story...
But in Skyfall, there was really no excuse (just as with having the gunbarrel at the end!). The film reintroduced Q and Moneypenny, featured the Aston Martin DB V and was considerably a much more lighter Craig outing. So I don't think it makes much sense to omit the Bond film when the film itself tries to go back to its roots.
Completely irrelevant.
Do not use this as an oppurtunity to include a bit of Brosnan-Bashing, I'm sure we're all sick of that.
Ah but my dear Fingerthunder, yours is all in good faith!
I'm pretty sure it's not going to Arnold, even if it's not Newman. They won a grammy with Newman - that may not have been justified, but I think he was better than Arnold given he only had one kick at the can.
It's obvious you and I are going to disagree on Newman vs. Arnold. Let's just look forward to the movie.
Then please take it elsewhere.
I'm not being vitriolic either. Just voicing my opinion which I think is relevent to the discussion at hand. I personally feel that the music during Brosnan's later tenure (which happened to have been done by Arnold) reflected the general lack of quality that I feel characterized everything during the Brosnan's last 3 (and particularly last 2) films. And that is directly relevent to the discussion of composer, although it is my opinion. Sorry if I did not make that clear.
And as I've said in the beginning, I think Arnold has potential - just that his scores haven't, for the most part, been memorable and he's had enough opportunities to correct that. You're welcome to disagree as it's just an opinion.