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But focus shifted to White of course.
I'm glad that specific scene didn't make it, since it would've been very similar to the end of CR and I already think they repeated the big picture/half monk half hitman arc as is.
Really? Do you happen to have a screenshot?
True, plus we wouldn't have had Madeleine as Mr. White's daughter be of much significance. As much as I feel NTTD was made in a lazy manner and took itself more silly than it should have, it's cool to hear Bond finally say he loves a her after in an earlier scene telling her he doesn't regret whatever he's been through to get to her.
You're right to question me on that one, @dramaticscenesofQOS.
What I extrapolated from fleeting images on screen, once slowed down and captured, does not absolutely confirm it as Haines I admit. If he's nearsighted and wears glasses otherwise, a closer match. Or what do you think?
I did have fun capturing it though, and it remains an obvious notion to me.
Hmmmm....it will pass, although I'm not convinced....perhaps the actor was replaced, haha.
There is plenty of space for producers to play with for a good video game retroactively connecting Quantum with Spectre to improve on the films or to release a longer cut of QoS (without the controversial final scene) with Daniel Craig and Judi Dench.
Spiderman No Way Home is getting re-released in theatres this September with more scenes.....
P1 = Stan Lee cameo?
This makes me think that hopefully he can flex his talent by directing Bond 26.
The business side of me says that there is plenty of room for him to salvage plot holes from QoS via a rerelease of QoS or video game etc....the Bond property has space for him to come back that is very mich more welcome than the kinds of connections the prior games have done at times. Every Bond game that DC was involved with was successful with critics because he is heavily involved and outs his best foot forward into it. The last game didn't have him and it was neither a critical nor financial success....and BB is telling newspapers she wishes DC would stick around....
The biggest "what if" of the Bond series to me is not Lazenby in Diamonds or Dalton's third film. It's what would Quantum Of Solace have been like if it wasn't for the writers strike?
As much as I really enjoy QOS and how much it's grown on me over the years, it always leaves me wishing there wasn't a writers strike.
I wish the story would have focused on Bond getting revenge for Vesper and Bond "going after the hand that held the whip" as the producers put it. Have him discover the organisation and leave it nameless.
It baffles me to think in all 25 films the only time Bond has gone on a revenge mission was for Felix's wife. QOS was the perfect opportunity, given the reaction to Casino's harder edge, Daniel's performance and to take the best aspect from the Boune series rather than copying the editing of the action.
Imagine if the ending of Quantum Of Solace had been Bond avenging Vesper, coming to terms with her betrayal and then discovering the truth of the organisation. Leaving it open-ended to the viewer and the possibility of it being Spectre.
I'd say both of them are mega impactful and received loads of screentime. Uggh... I can't choose.
Primo looked like Yusef Kabira.....if the Kabira character had been used (with or without the same actor), it would have had so much more emotional pull towards the story.
Keep the direct sequels. We already have all those 1962-2002 Bond movies that messed up when DAF dropped the ball with its potential....even when SC came back, they didn't use his potential in such a way that made it memorable for him creatively to want to come back. It was just a cash grab for everyone and in the end, the audience paid dearly (same with DAD).
The idea that some of the more dramatic scenes were filmed when very few crew were available to be present and keep the set makes it much more valuable but you have to know these things as the general audience does not have time to really invest in learning all these things. So a re-released version can perhaps edit some of the things like the Quantum being named and for the term to be reutilized in the dialogue towards its emotional value (Bond's quantum of solace). Dialogue can easily be redone in a remastering.
Craig said in an interview once that Quantum wasn't going to be as much of a direct sequel until he and Forster had to pick up the pieces during the Writer's Strike. https://collider.com/daniel-craig-quantum-of-solace-script-problems/
"Me and the director were the ones allowed to do it. The rules were that you couldn’t employ anyone as a writer, but the actor and director could work on scenes together. We were stuffed. We got away with it, but only just. It was never meant to be as much of a sequel as it was, but it ended up being a sequel, starting where the last one finished."
While I think Bond forgiving himself and Vesper is the strongest aspect of the film, the way they retreaded CR with him killing their leads and learning to think with his head was tedious. He was in that position already when he shot Mr. White in the leg and introduced himself, it just wasn't as signposted. I've long thought that while the plot picks up from that last scene narratively, in terms of where Bond is at emotionally it's a follow on from "the bitch is dead", which is why it feels disconnected to me.
I remember watching that interview....yes, DC and Forster saved the script and made it relate more to CR....thankfully.
The thing is, at the time they didn't have the rights for Spectre and no reason to believe they'd have it soon afterwards. Naming the organisation was not such a bad idea, all things considered.
I am no scriptwriter, but personally wouldn't have changed much from the original product, had I been a scriptwriter on the film and no writer's strike. I would have added some element from the short story to make the link with the title and movie more organic (Mathis telling the plot of the short story in the plane with Bond?). I would have added a few quieter moments to give us time to breath and for the plot to flow a bit better. I think the villain's scheme is brilliant and very plausible, but they don't do much with it in the end. I would have extended Guy Haines' role and maybe make him an antagonist almost at the same level as Greene. A bit like the Spangs in DAF (but obviously not brothers). I would have kept Elvis as pathetic, but make him a more sinister buffoon. Have him kill, maybe even rape beforehand Strawberry Fields? Just give him a sinister edge. By himself, he's helpless and hopeless, but because he works for Greene, he can be a perv. And pair him with another henchman who is a more capable fighter, like Oddjob or Hinx. Just not a clone of Grant this time.
They did a brilliant job considering the circumstances, to make the film as enjoyable as it is. Whenever I watch it I just imagine what direction they have gone in.
I know they didn't get the rights back to Spectre till 2013, I wish they would have added more mystery and intrigue to the organisation leaving it nameless
@Agent_Zero_One that's a great point to be fair mate. I just always wonder what it would have been like to have seen Bond get vengeance for Vesper and then realise, it didn't change anything. Just push Bond to the edge like the YOLT novel and see what that did to his character, especially as the film is a sequel to Casino.
Great point about the ending of CR, it does feel like it picks up emotionally from "the bitch is dead line". I've never thought of that before
Emotionally, yes, Bond is still affected by Vesper's betrayal and death. The writing and Craig's acting are subtle and communicate this without the need for big emotional speeches or moments. By the end, in preventing Yusief from tricking another woman/repeating the same fate Vesper suffered, it genuinely feels like Bond gets some sort of closure. As much as I have problems with the execution of this film, the bare bones and many of the ideas are actually pretty solid.
Oh I agree they did great given the constraints. And a 2006-2012 gap would have hurt the series badly.
Exactly. His performance is stunning actually.
Well it's always just how you read these things of course, and I guess for everyone involved there was a different shade to the logic, but to my mind Bond himself is dedicated to his job. Yes, he wants revenge, but it comes second. We get plenty of hints that way. Its M and the CIA that are way behind and find it hard to fathom he can be so professional. Fields' death isn't a wake-up call for Bond, it's a message frome Greene, and it puts pressure on Bond as M/MI6 are mislead about the oil, something he knows fits the CIA story, and M falls for 'what do you mean ith 'there is no oil' or something in that vain.
I love QoS because Bond isn't the clear-cut hero. He asn't in Fleming's work, and he isn't here. He is fallible, human, but dedicated and stubborn. In that QoS has (by far) the best portrayal of Bond compared to Fleming's creation.
And on that notion of Craig and Forster writing, I think Craig is just too insecure on his own creative skills. Sure, there are some plotholes, but hell, they're no worse than anything P&W have churned up over the years. Its just that, because of the strike, too much attention is going that way. I think the writing is quite solid and creative.
I don't necessarily see Bond pocketing Vesper's picture as him wanting revenge. It's mostly to try and make sense of why she would betray him in the way she did, the boyfriend being that loose strand. Ultimately it was a way to make sense of the whole thing. I mean, he didn't know at that point that Yusief was purposely tricking these other women into revealing information, only that the body found that was meant to be his wasn't. Who exactly would he kill to get revenge? The most logical thing to do was to investigate this mysterious organisation, do his job and ultimately bring them down.
As Bond says at the end he 'never left'... he never stopped doing his job. Not really sure how Field's death is a wake up call exactly... if anything it plays into the idea that women who get close to Bond inevitably die because of him.
As I said, I'm not sure how well pieced together this film is in many respects. I would say, however, that this aspect of the film is pretty solid. Neither Campbell nor Craig were the directors/writers so wouldn't necessarily have that insight into the film. Craig in that press statement seems to desperately be trying to cram in the title 'quantum of solace' in a way which reasonably can be connected to the Fleming short story. Hell I get the impression they only decided upon the title and are trying to find tentative ways to connect it to their story, the ropiest decision of which can be seen when Green claims the organisation is called 'Quantum'.
But I thought Quantum was the perfect name for the organisation. As CalTech state in regard to quantum physics: 'quantum phenomena are all around us, acting on every scale. However, we may not be able to detect them easily in larger objects.' It couldn't be more apt!