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Absolutely. For my money, Silva was not an actual member of Spectre. They just heard about his campaign against MI6 and financed him, leading to Nine Eyes. Clever stuff, though I wish they had been just a little bit more clear about the subject in Spectre, otherwise one might get the impression Silva was just another Blofeld employee, which weakens his character, in my view.
Using Silva who has a personal grudge to upset the apple cart is much better idea. Eluding he's full blown SPECTRE is just ridiculous but what do I know.
The toxicology report showed him as wearing the SPECTRE ring, so he was a member.
That's essentially how I've viewed it.
Well, either Silva was an agent and had a ring, meaning he was under Blofeld's orders, or he shook the hands with men who had the rings (as a "thanks for the resources" gesture in a secret meeting) and went on as a mere associate of fortune.
If the latter, the character's relative independence is retained, which people seemed to want. If it's the former, then there is at least the interesting irony of the man who teased Bond about serving and bending his knee to keepers being a loyal dog of another kind.
Let's face it, the latter is not the best explanation, but I'll take it. The whole explanation about the ring was poorly handled in Spectre, anyway.
I'm not bothered by it either way. But cool to wonder about. I need to wrestle Sam down for an interview and make him spill his guts.
The ring was ridiculous (but fun) in TB (still way too obvious) but was totally insane in SP ... and I still don't get the octopus thing when the organization's name is SPECTRE (and we saw a ghost logo on the old rings ... which makes sense).
Never got the hoopla over the rings, but that's besides the point. I think the early ring designs made it pretty ambiguous about if it's supposed to be a ghost or octopus, especially the TB design which has 8 legs (or tentacles on it). The FRWL ring is the only one that could actually be confused for a ghost, but you can still see the tentacle aspects of the design quite clearly. Both figures make sense for the organization, with their haunting presence acting unnoticed like a ghost, and their control over so many aspects of a globalized word, like they've wrapped their tentacles around the earth. But amongst fans and scholars, I think the decision is set on the octopus anyway.
http://img07.deviantart.net/ec64/i/2015/097/9/f/spectre_logo_evolution_by_jarvisrama99-d8ou4m7.png
I think SP actually has the best design in regards to how it looks, as it is the most ambiguous between a ghost and an octopus. The eyes on the old rings make them feel more animalistic than spiritual, but the clean and minimalist modern ring is much more mysterious and could be either figure because of its more restrained design. It's also plain enough not to put a scent on the organization if it was found.
@SeanCraig, as I said, I think SP balances well between octopus and ghost insignia, and makes it a part of the titles and themes of the film so for me, what you want is already there. Like how TB had the octopus imagery and the briefing that showed us the tentacles of control SPECTRE had while also having Bond tease Largo about a "specter" at his shoulder, SP has the same duality between ghost and octopus imagery, and more of it.
The opening titles of SP do have images of octopi, but you can also see sections where the tentacles of the octopus featured are misty/foggy, like a ghost's, as they travel through the design to make that specter connection; on top of that there's skull imagery to again convey a sense of ghostly presence from beyond the grave. Kleinman was no doubt conscious of the themes of the film and how the minimalist design of the SPECTRE logo could be either an octopus or ghost, and so he created a title design that catered to both insignias as we've never seen before (in such quantity).
In the film itself we see the tentacles of SPECTRE in Rome as the members share the massive worldwide hold the organization has and how it has been able to manipulate things to make Nine Eyes a reality, connecting the image of an octopus to the real actions of the group. On top of this, however, Bond is significantly and symbolically built up as a messenger of death from the very beginning in his Day of the Dead garb, connecting his mission to kill Sciarra and get his ring to the very meaning Mexicans hold in the day itself, where their loved ones return to the earth in a spiritual form, much like M did to give Bond the mission on her recorded video. Furthering the ghost imagery and themes, Blofeld is built as an opposing force to Bond who is an actual ghost from his past in a figurative and literal sense, because Bond thought Franz died long ago and seeing him alive in front of him is like seeing a corpse reanimate himself. This imagery is aided by the fact that Blofeld's SPECTRE has been haunting Bond for years through Quantum, again giving them a ghost-like appeal in addition to their octopus connections.
In this way, images connoting spirits, ghosts, hauntings and life from beyond the grave all come together to service the specter side of the organization in SP, as do many that service the idea of SPECTRE being a metaphorical octopus. Because of this, the film is for my money the best when it comes to realizing that duality of SPECTRE, backed up by the more minimalist design for the organization that more effectively represents both a ghost or octopus without the design favoring one or the other. It's a balance that to this point has never been so well struck in the series, as the group has more widely been synonymous with the octopus and the films themselves do little to address this in the way that SP quite beautifully layers its imagery and themes that serve the larger story and the very duality SPECTRE itself holds in tandem.
I found it so... obvious, generic even. It sounded less like an organic line of dialogue and more like "[insert ejector seat comment here]".
You should really do literary studies.
They also love to see things that aren't there.
Really do you indeed believe that the same people who - two times in a row (!) - didn't give a toss about making up only slightly coherent and logical stories would really go to the lenghts necessary to work up all the things you imagine?
You ought to read more Jung. Fleming did. And it explains a lot.
Might be a bit too heavy in content for someone who can't read simple themes in films. Perhaps we should recommend See Spot Run as a practice text to lead up to Jung.
I have read Jung and when it comes to SF it explains nothing
Just the same themes you find in abundance in masterpieces like General Hospital
Don't hate me just because I'm gifted.
@peter, he's got the being a whiny baby bit down pat, though.
As so many things discussed here humor is a matter of taste and style. Not that I would expect either one by someone, who watches family guy.
@noSolaceleft
I never said that. Most of what I am writing on SF is done with a wink and a smile.
@ClarkDevlin
1. It was a deathtrap for Silva, because he is not an agent that works well in the field. He has distaste for it, said it himself. It shows during his bungled attempt to assassinate M during the hearing. Bond wanted the advantage...and he had it, really.
2. Remember, M went along with this plan to get Silva in territory he does not like. And the plan all but worked, except for a stray bullet.
3. The use of "breadcrumbs" to lead Silva was all that could be communicated. Anything else had the potential of being intercepted. So, yes: no backup, no communications.
4. Bond's mistake was in not realizing his arsenal at Skyfall had been auctioned off. No biggie. Some times the "old ways" are the best.