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Do they hate Bond? Well I found it to be a pretty good portrayal of the character and thought it could have been worse. Nomi frequently didn't out perform Bond, in fact Bond saved her a few times. Paloma being a rookie and having amazing talent was a bit of a reach as she acted anything but a rookie. Whether this was the character fooling around or whether she was really that good and inexperienced I suppose is left to the viewer. But if she was a rookie and she's doing things that Bond a veteran is doing I suppose that is a slag at Bond.
Bond was often slow in discovering things in Craig's tenure and I believe never really had a mission successfully completed so I guess there is that. I would say that the film treated the character pretty well when compared to other white male characters. I sense that Indiana Jones is going to get "deconstructed" or put in his place by a strong female character.
Yeah, I feel ya. But culture is integral to all of us and negative aspects, like promoting drug use as hip and cool like the Marlboro Man smoking for instance, DOES influence children to a certain extent. I care about our society, truly, and the downward slide of morality is in fact tied to cinema and its pervasive influence. Where do you draw the line? It seeps in everywhere.
Now, back on topic please.
Love for the original films. Love for the character. Love for the original producers. Love for Ian Fleming himself.
Cooked in with that was a deep respect for why people like Bond "do what they do". Even mining WWII and Cold War origins.
Mentioned quickly in QOS as his duty.
A great achievement by the producers
Absolutely. This is why the OHMSS theme during the chat with M worked for me, though it apparently annoyed a lot of fans.
And seeing Robert Brown on the wall? Yeah, it's fan service, but man did I feel love there.
Yes, I had no issues at all with those bits you mentioned.
@RichardTheBruce beautifully stated.
One of the most frequent things I've read, not here but on other fan pages, is how Paloma should've been the main Bond girl and how great she was and the Madeline character and Seydoux are awful, etc. My take is Paloma was used just right. There's every indication she'd have worn out her welcome or become a repeat of what we've seen previously, and Nomi was necessary to fill that role as Bond's frenemy.
That's one way of putting it.
If you guys think it's a celebration, go for it!
Bond has even less fun in the sheets than with the previous blonde love interest, Kara Milovy. Ultimately, the "woke" duo of Barbara and Daniel provide the final coup-de-grace, much like a latter-day, gender-swapped Zorin and May Day.
/sarcasm
Wow. WOOOOOOW! They killed a fictional character in a movie. Get over it.
They're fictional murderers. They should go to fictional trial, where they would be found fictionally guilty, and sentenced to fictional jail.
I can't say that I downright hate a movie. That's a bit strong, isn't it? There are tons of films I don't like, but I'm not being dramatic about them.
And yes, perhaps we should build us a fictional shrine for Bond and Felix too.
Besides, we know he's not dead. He faked it all to leave his wife and daughter behind and spend some hot salsa nights with Paloma. Isn't that the ending the NTTD "haters" want? 😄
I don't ever recall feeling I hated a movie either. I have a found a select few annoying, and an even more select few very annoying. Like nails on a chalkboard. But not hated.
But I think it's plausible to hate a movie, particularly if one feels its point of view is morally reprehensible.
Well, yes, you are probably right. I find half of the stuff people throw on YouTube morally reprehensible, so I guess I can hate those videos, or rather the system that supports and encourages them.
But Bond films have always tried to entertain, including CR67 and NSNA. It's well known around here that I struggle tremendously with the latter. In fact, I have called it a work of hatred before, not from the POV of Kershner, but certainly from that of McClory. I can't shake the feeling that, if he could have, he would have taken down both the Fleming and Broccoli/Saltzman legacies behind 007. And then there's Connery, who probably needed the money, but also said some unfortunate things about Cubby that show clear signs of resentment (hatred, perhaps?). Still, a lot of people working on that film did what they could to make it as good as possible. I think it's a poorly written, worse executed and terribly looking and sounding film, nowhere near the quality of the average EON film, but I don't hate it. I'm not going to hate-watch a film; I have tons of other films to explore. And I keep revisiting NSNA, so there you have it, I don't hate NSNA. ;-)
Now, returning to the original question of this thread; does NTTD hate James Bond? Taken literally, the question makes no sense so let's rephrase it as "do the people who worked on NTTD hate James Bond?" If they hated James Bond, they wouldn't have made the film in the first place. Or they would have reshaped the formula into something they didn't hate. The fact that they made and proudly delivered this expensive film, means they don't hate James Bond. And they have no reason to. Sigourney Weaver didn't hate Ripley when she demanded that her character be killed off in Fincher's film.
There are things that NTTD does and there are things the film doesn't do. And both seem to upset a number of fans. I can respect that. But I have gone over the film with a microscope a few times now and can't, for the life of me, find anything that deserves such a strong response as hatred. Perhaps I can conceit this much: with a tone so dark and cold at times, the things that do stick out as a bit odd are less easily ignored. DAD is full of WTFs, yet halfway through the film, we realise that Romeo Must Die and PlayStation had a baby, so we stop caring. Goofy DAF could have gotten away with a flying saucer from Mars at the end, and no reason to suspect that TMWTGG couldn't have sold us on James Bond trapping a killer midget in a travel bag. (Oh, wait.) But the Craig era was built on the expectation that this James Bond would be more naturalistic, grittier, and a little cynical at times yet certainly in keeping with the Fleming legacy. And already in 2008, they were forced to commit to something slightly different. Then the SkyFall event happened, and then delays, frustration, the controversial SP, and something about wrists being slit happened. And since then, the Craigs have been under attack. Person X sees one way out, person Y another, and person Z yet another. And then the film does things no one could have predicted, and some are fine with that, others aren't.
But to say that this project is the product of hatred from its filmmakers towards their primary moneymaker, goes a bit too far. You know, I am convinced that Broccoli, Wilson, Craig, Fukunaga and many others are genuinely proud of NTTD. Again, you don't shoot a film like this if you hated James Bond. At the very least, you still want to make money off of all the other films, and you're not helping that cause any bit by pissing on your own parade, as Greene would have put it, and telling the world that this James Bond fella means nothing to you.
They don't hate Bond. They just don't mind takings risks and pushing the envelope.
Whether it this film pushed it too far is very much up to debate. I kind of think they did, but only time will tell.
Sadly, I do think there's a slight sense of shame. Perhaps a struggle to constantly prove Bond's relevance and value for modern audiences?
Social media doesn't really help with constant articles and posts advocating Bond to change and be reinvented.
Their unrestrained callbacks to all the previous films over time do tell another story. And to relate to another discussion, that would be about love of their own franchise and the character.
In the end, scorn would be a better term than hate. The producers have no problem turning Bond into a figure of contempt for every other character, the complete opposite of all previous Bond eras where he was a symbol of victory against the odds, while simultaneously riding the coat tails of those same eras which they scorn. This is off-the-charts cynicism, but that's Hollywood.