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Bill Tanner | Chief of Staff

ChiefTannerChiefTanner Wilmington, DE, USA
edited March 2015 in Bond Movies Posts: 34
I always found the character of Chief of Staff Bill Tanner interesting in the Fleming as well as Gardner James Bond Novels.
The idea that Bond has a friend that knows who he really is I think is often overlooked in all the media that include the character. I hope Eon continues to keep the character in the films.
This thread is for discussion on the character of Bill Tanner and his place in the 007 lore.
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Comments

  • ChiefTannerChiefTanner Wilmington, DE, USA
    Posts: 34
    I can see your point. I'm excited to see how Kinnear's Tanner will work with Fiennes' M. There is a chance for more harmless animosity between Tanner and the Boss. Tanner comes up under Dench's M and is now dealing with the replacement. That could be interesting.
  • ChiefTannerChiefTanner Wilmington, DE, USA
    Posts: 34
    I did like this scene with the beer bottle and the dialogue between these two and Mallory. tumblr_mr2wf99axy1qcrwbio1_500.jpg
  • JamesSpectreJamesSpectre
    Posts: 164
    Birdleson wrote: »
    Roy Kinnear's Tanner seems far off mark to me in both appearance and how he is written/portrayed.

    The chief of staff at my dad's work is exactly like Roy Kinnear's Tanner. Of course, he doesn't work in intelligence and it's probably just a coincidence, but still :)
  • OnlyManWhoCanOnlyManWhoCan Greater London
    Posts: 202
    Gotta say I'm a big fan of Rory Kinnear's Tanner, but I love the character himself. There's something reassuring about having a middleman in the 'Bond Team,' who has 007's back. We might dream of being Bond, but Tanner's the guy most of us could actually be.
  • ChiefTannerChiefTanner Wilmington, DE, USA
    Posts: 34
    OnlyManWhoCan I agree. He's a bureaucrat, but he has that "pathetic love of country" that Bond also has. In so many ways he and the others at Regent's Park are just as important to what Bond does as Bond is himself!
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Birdleson wrote: »
    I do like the literary Tanner. The only cinematic version that has seemed to capture the essence of the character form the novels is Michael Kitchen. Roy Kinnear's Tanner seems far off mark to me in both appearance and how he is written/portrayed.

    I agree. He is supposed to be Bonds friend and confidant......not M's gimp/ slightly wimpy lap dog like Kinnears Tanner.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    To the contrary, I Iove the casting of Fiennes as M.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited March 2015 Posts: 9,117
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Birdleson wrote: »
    I do like the literary Tanner. The only cinematic version that has seemed to capture the essence of the character form the novels is Michael Kitchen. Roy Kinnear's Tanner seems far off mark to me in both appearance and how he is written/portrayed.

    I agree. He is supposed to be Bonds friend and confidant......not M's gimp/ slightly wimpy lap dog like Kinnears Tanner.

    Couldn't agree more. Kitchen's Tanner is the closest we've ever seen of the character being properly portrayed.
    Kinnear's Tanner is the human equivalent of watching paint dry. Remember if M has the flu or something (kidnapped by a Chinese mentalist, the actor portraying him dies and they don't want to recast out of respect) Tanner is in charge!!

    Now if I worked for MI6 and was sitting around doing bugger all I can imagine Kitchen giving me a bollocking but if Kinnear tried it I'd just say 'piss off Rory I'm on YouTube' and you get the impression he'd meekly skulk back to his office.
  • SarkSark Guangdong, PRC
    Posts: 1,138
    If someone asked me to define the term "grey man" i'd point to the current version of Tanner. Completely featureless and boring. I'd respect Bond a lot less if he was actually friends with this guy.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    edited March 2015 Posts: 18,281
    Sark wrote: »
    If someone asked me to define the term "grey man" i'd point to the current version of Tanner. Completely featureless and boring. I'd respect Bond a lot less if he was actually friends with this guy.

    Yes, it's a character they've rarely got right in the films and I heartily agree that Michael Kitchen is by far the best Tanner of the lot so far.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    Sark wrote: »
    If someone asked me to define the term "grey man" i'd point to the current version of Tanner. Completely featureless and boring. I'd respect Bond a lot less if he was actually friends with this guy.

    Rory certainly the epitome of Fleming's 'man who is a silhouette'. Should he be playing Bond instead?

    The guy is so anonymous he could just walk into the Kremlin and rifle through all their secret files in broad daylight and no one would notice.
  • SarkSark Guangdong, PRC
    Posts: 1,138
    In that sense he'd be a far better spy than 007 ;)
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    I agree with those who think M Kitchen, has been the best Tanner, as he did seem
    To be Bond's Friend.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    As for an anonymous guy, then we wouldn't be watching him. As Bond tends to be played by Film stars who are usually good looking and full of charisma. :D
  • ChiefTannerChiefTanner Wilmington, DE, USA
    edited March 2015 Posts: 34
    So it seems that Kinnear is not our favorite in the role and at the same time Villiers character was too anti-Bond.
    That said, do we think that there is hope that in SPECTRE and going forward Tanner changes slightly as a result of Fiennes M?

    Also who can we imagine would be the best casting of Tanner instead of Kinnear?
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    I thought there was a slight change with Tanner in Skyfall. He seemed to be a little bit less " official" with Bond. So who knows he may become more of a " mate" to Bond in spectre.
  • ChiefTannerChiefTanner Wilmington, DE, USA
    Posts: 34
    That's something I've been thinking. He as well as Bond are the only two MI6 left from Olivia Mansfield's(Dench) M. Maybe that means that Tanner and 007 can bond (pun intended) over dealing with the new guy. (Fiennes) I think that Bond, Tanner and Moneypenny all will respect the new M. The last scene in skyfall sets that up. Still I heard Mendes speak in the first behind the scenes clip from SPECTRE. He said something to the effect that Bond is now the senior and more experienced (at MI6). Maybe that means growing pains?
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,124
    I think people are unfair about Rory Kinnear's portrayal of Bill Tanner. So he lacks charisma? News flash: he is a civil servant, the Chief of Staff in MI6. He is not James Bond, not an 00 operative, not a station agent, he is a civil servant with a desk job. He has more often a cup of coffee in his hand than a gun.
  • ChiefTannerChiefTanner Wilmington, DE, USA
    Posts: 34
    Ludovico wrote: »
    I think people are unfair about Rory Kinnear's portrayal of Bill Tanner. So he lacks charisma? News flash: he is a civil servant, the Chief of Staff in MI6. He is not James Bond, not an 00 operative, not a station agent, he is a civil servant with a desk job. He has more often a cup of coffee in his hand than a gun.

    Or that bottle of Heineken! I do actually like his portrayal, but I see where people want him to be more of a buddy with Bond.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    But both can be deadly. :))
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,124
    ChiefTanner wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    I think people are unfair about Rory Kinnear's portrayal of Bill Tanner. So he lacks charisma? News flash: he is a civil servant, the Chief of Staff in MI6. He is not James Bond, not an 00 operative, not a station agent, he is a civil servant with a desk job. He has more often a cup of coffee in his hand than a gun.

    Or that bottle of Heineken! I do actually like his portrayal, but I see where people want him to be more of a buddy with Bond.

    That's fine and me too, but this can develop with the actor we have. One of the issues with Felix Leiter, why he never made a true impact or lasting impression among casual fans was because he was recast to death. From one movie to another, he was such a different character that by the time they did LTK, nobody cared that he lost his leg but Bond fans.
  • SirHilaryBraySirHilaryBray Scotland
    Posts: 2,138
    I like Kinnear, I agree though so far he's portrayed as M's PA I hope in Spectre he is more his own man. Kitchen was good but he wasn't utiilised enough.
  • ChiefTannerChiefTanner Wilmington, DE, USA
    Posts: 34
    Ludovico wrote: »
    ChiefTanner wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    I think people are unfair about Rory Kinnear's portrayal of Bill Tanner. So he lacks charisma? News flash: he is a civil servant, the Chief of Staff in MI6. He is not James Bond, not an 00 operative, not a station agent, he is a civil servant with a desk job. He has more often a cup of coffee in his hand than a gun.

    Or that bottle of Heineken! I do actually like his portrayal, but I see where people want him to be more of a buddy with Bond.

    That's fine and me too, but this can develop with the actor we have. One of the issues with Felix Leiter, why he never made a true impact or lasting impression among casual fans was because he was recast to death. From one movie to another, he was such a different character that by the time they did LTK, nobody cared that he lost his leg but Bond fans.


    Agreed
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    Ludovico wrote: »
    I think people are unfair about Rory Kinnear's portrayal of Bill Tanner. So he lacks charisma? News flash: he is a civil servant, the Chief of Staff in MI6. He is not James Bond, not an 00 operative, not a station agent, he is a civil servant with a desk job. He has more often a cup of coffee in his hand than a gun.

    Q and Moneypenny are also just civil servants but there is also a character there for the audience to hang on to. Ask the average cinemagoer after watching SF do they remember the character of Tanner and they seriously wouldn't have a clue who you are talking about. When you explained the very faintest vague recognition might spread across their face as they said 'oh you mean that bloke who was basically M's dogsbody?'

    This guy's job title is Chief of Staff - that basically means he's M's number 2 and can order Bond, Q and Moneypenny about but as written (and portrayed) he's just a featureless nobody that blends into the wallpaper. If M was assassinated would anyone out there seriously be confident with the nation's security falling into the hands of dear old Rory? Nice enough bloke and all I'm sure but really he's just the same character as Villiers (who was just a male Moneypenny) but far less interesting.

    We spend way too much screentime with MI6 crew and their office tribulations as it is so why not just put Rory out of my misery and let him go?

    Just a quick flirt with MP, mission briefing from M and a gadget scene with Q will do. The screen Tanner (and the literary one for that matter) adds very little to the oeuvre as a whole except a bit of blatant exposition. We managed to get through 46 years fine without him (TMWTGG & FYEO notwithstanding) so I don't really see why he is suddenly so indispensable. His appearances in the novels were sporadic at best anyway so there really is no need for him to make anything more than the occasional appearance is there?

  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,718
    Put Rory Kinnear next to Stacey Sutton, Jinx and Christmas Jones, what would happen? He'd cease to exist because the acting skills of these 3 characters would tower over him.
  • SarkSark Guangdong, PRC
    Posts: 1,138
    I think that might be a bit unfair :))
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,124
    TheWizardOfIce wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    I think people are unfair about Rory Kinnear's portrayal of Bill Tanner. So he lacks charisma? News flash: he is a civil servant, the Chief of Staff in MI6. He is not James Bond, not an 00 operative, not a station agent, he is a civil servant with a desk job. He has more often a cup of coffee in his hand than a gun.

    Q and Moneypenny are also just civil servants but there is also a character there for the audience to hang on to. Ask the average cinemagoer after watching SF do they remember the character of Tanner and they seriously wouldn't have a clue who you are talking about. When you explained the very faintest vague recognition might spread across their face as they said 'oh you mean that bloke who was basically M's dogsbody?'

    This guy's job title is Chief of Staff - that basically means he's M's number 2 and can order Bond, Q and Moneypenny about but as written (and portrayed) he's just a featureless nobody that blends into the wallpaper. If M was assassinated would anyone out there seriously be confident with the nation's security falling into the hands of dear old Rory? Nice enough bloke and all I'm sure but really he's just the same character as Villiers (who was just a male Moneypenny) but far less interesting.

    We spend way too much screentime with MI6 crew and their office tribulations as it is so why not just put Rory out of my misery and let him go?

    Just a quick flirt with MP, mission briefing from M and a gadget scene with Q will do. The screen Tanner (and the literary one for that matter) adds very little to the oeuvre as a whole except a bit of blatant exposition. We managed to get through 46 years fine without him (TMWTGG & FYEO notwithstanding) so I don't really see why he is suddenly so indispensable. His appearances in the novels were sporadic at best anyway so there really is no need for him to make anything more than the occasional appearance is there?

    Well, I for one am happy we do use MI6 and more than the M-Q-Moneypenny trinity and the odd station agent. Not overuse them of course, but Bond works for an organization, not as a single entity. I said it in another thread: in DN, FRWL and to a lesser extend TB, MI6 is featured extensively and nobody complains. In DN, it takes a while before Bond to show up, the focus is on the whole network set in motion by the murders on the other side of the world. Why can't Tanner be featured among MI6 civil servants I simply don't understand.

    And I know he was used sporadically in Ian Fleming's novels... But he was still used in the original novels, and is a character from the source material. That is good enough for me to have him featured. I want more Fleming in the movies, not less. And Moneypenny was far more sporadically used in the novels, so was Boothroyd.
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    The thing is Kinnear is a gifted actor and shows a real talent for comedy in the love it (I do) or hate it Count Arthur Strong. He's inherited his Dad's talent there.

    I think his character isn't supposed to be a charisma magnet but I also agree he is a bit dull but I don't think that is Rory's fault, the character of Tanner in QOS and SF isn't actually teeming with much more than an assistant that is used to relate info to Bond from M, maybe he'll get more to chew over in SP.

    I don't like the PB era and wasn't blown away by Kitchen's portrayal, not his fault he's a talented actor he's just unfortunate to be attached to the most redundant era of the series.
  • JCRendleJCRendle
    Posts: 1,552
    Shardlake wrote: »
    The thing is Kinnear is a gifted actor and shows a real talent for comedy in the love it (I do) or hate it Count Arthur Strong.
    From what I've seen, it's not my type of comedy - nothing to do with Kinnear though. He was brilliant in Black Mirror, The Casual Vacancy, The Imitation Game and Penny Dreadful and I enjoy him as Tanner.
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    JCRendle wrote: »
    Shardlake wrote: »
    The thing is Kinnear is a gifted actor and shows a real talent for comedy in the love it (I do) or hate it Count Arthur Strong.
    From what I've seen, it's not my type of comedy - nothing to do with Kinnear though. He was brilliant in Black Mirror, The Casual Vacancy, The Imitation Game and Penny Dreadful and I enjoy him as Tanner.

    To be honest I didn't think it would be mine but it's co written by Graham Lineham (Father Ted, IT Crowd) so I had to give it a go. It is quite old school sit com based but I got caught up with it and while the title character could annoy some it became quite endearing and the double act between Steve Delaney (CAS) and Rory offer some quite priceless quality moments. The 2nd series offered a hilarious comic riff on Misery.

    It's not going to be everyone's taste but it's streets above Mrs Brown's Boys or Miranda as what British and Irish comedy has had to offer of recent.
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