SPECTRE - Press reviews and personal reviews (BEWARE! Spoiler reviews allowed)

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  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020

    I agree too. Anyone else agree? If we find 50 'agrees' we win the lottery :-P.

    On this site you'll get 50 votes in no time.

  • On this site you'll get 50 votes in no time.

    >:D< you need a hug
  • Posts: 582

    >:D< you need a hug

    Can I agree a second time? :)
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    tigers99 wrote: »

    Can I agree a second time? :)

    Spectre is the best Bond movie ever, closely followed by Goldeneye, tee-hee <:-P
  • SirHilaryBraySirHilaryBray Scotland
    edited November 2015 Posts: 2,138
    Ludovico wrote: »
    Because Ben and Naomi are big stars now? As in Halle Berry big? Or Denise Richards big? And were they so prominently used in SP?

    Ludovico I could have gone to a bookmaker and put money on anyone on this forum coming back with arguing black was white it would be you.

    Berry and Richards were your typical cast Bond girls, they have always been prominent in the movies. My point is that the whole case now is made up of people and when scripting they are trying to share screen time to keep them all happy. In this Waltz and Seydoux give them loads of screen time absolutely but not have Mallory, Q and MP out in the field and anything more than a few minutes in the film. Because of this it has developed in to a TEAM MI6 thing. That's not really Bond, Bond is a lone wolf.

    You ditch the need to keep a high profile supporting cast, you limit their time on screen it gives you more creative space to focus on Bond, the mission, the villain the over all plot. Rather than "we better make him go back to London again, so that we give Fiennes, Wishaw and Harris some more screen time.

    Old formula

    PTS
    Bond doing something at his leisure before being summoned to HQ
    MP - A few minutes flirting
    M - 5 to 10 minutes tops "here is your mission report to Q branch in the morning/now"
    Q - 5 minutes - "Here is what I have for you 007"
    Bond arriving in some far off location, investigating
    Bond Meets the main Bond girl of the movie, likely using her to get to someone else
    Car chase
    A twist
    Second Exotic Location
    A second girl
    A showdown and gun fight
    Bond 1 on 1 with the villain
    MP - final flirt a few minutes
    M - Congratulation - a few minutes

    I don't mind it cutting back to London showing M in meeting with ministers or official is it is pertinent to the story. Those aspects have been around from Connery films. Just not central to the action or helping Bond do his job in the field.

    We have gone from the UK supporting cast being in the film for 20 minutes to them featuring in most of the films. It started with Dame Judi - "Oh we have Dame Judi, we better use her more than we did any previous M and it has just grown arms and legs it didn't matter where he went she would show up, right through Brosnan and now Craig, I thought when they did away with her in Skyfall all of it would stop, but it was worse in Spectre.

    Bond 25 give me William Boyd - Solo, just so I can see Bond solo again without it before we start renaming the films "The M Team".

  • Posts: 15,430
    dragonsky wrote: »
    Interesting comment I found on youtube:


    This is just a thought, but could the villians of the Daniel Graig James Bond films represent the Seven Deadly Sins?
    Casino Royale: Le Chiffre = Greed (banker of the underworld)
    Quantum of Solace; Greene = Gluttony (wants the watersupply of Bolivia)
    Skyfall: Silvia = Wrath (wants revenge on MI6 and M)
    spectre: Blofeld = Pride ('i am the author of all your pain' (or something like that), he sees himself above Bond, which you could say 'pride').

    What is left: Envy, Lust and Sloth.

    Involuntarily but yes.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 41,111
    To be fair, @Gustav_Graves - and I'm going off of a page 86 post of yours - you did trash QoS for not being in depth and explaining where the dams came from, and yet a few posts later, you said that we should look to the older films, where we were simply entertained and didn't need all the answers. So, which is it? I see the plot of QoS trashed a lot on here, when it really isn't that difficult to grasp. Do we really need to see how the dams are built? Should we go into Greene's backstory as a kid? Maybe delve into what types of sweets are Elvis' favorites, while we're at it?
  • SirHilaryBraySirHilaryBray Scotland
    Posts: 2,138
    Ludovico wrote: »

    Involuntarily but yes.

    Blofeld was Envy when you think about it. But no surprise as the trigger for a mad man will always be something sinful.
  • Posts: 11,425
    You people live in your own world.

    All 4 Brosnan movies did more than good. I'm pretty sure everyone involved was very happy from 1995-2002.

    And outside of such forums, the Brosnan-era is not looked upon more critically than Dalton's or even Moore's.

    Get a grip and face reality.

    A lot of people have mentioned to me recently how awful the Brosnan era was. A friend of mine who grew up with Brosnan as Bond could only muster 'GE was pretty good, but that's because of Sean Bean'.

    Look at the Brosnan and Dalton movies on IMDB, Rotten Tomatoes or wherever, and apart from GE all the Brosnan films rank lower than the Dalton films. Even GE ties with LTK on Rotten Tomatoes.

    There's an outdated assumption that people don't like Dalton, but times have changed. As with Lazenby and OHMSS (once dismissed as a second rate irrelevance) fans and critics have come to appreciate Dalton a lot more. Infact, if you read the reviews, Dalton was getting a lot of positive press even at the time.
  • SirHilaryBraySirHilaryBray Scotland
    Posts: 2,138
    Getafix wrote: »

    A lot of people have mentioned to me recently how awful the Brosnan era was. A friend of mine who grew up with Brosnan as Bond could only muster 'GE was pretty good, but that's because of Sean Bean'.

    Look at the Brosnan and Dalton movies on IMDB, Rotten Tomatoes or wherever, and apart from GE all the Brosnan films rank lower than the Dalton films. Even GE ties with LTK on Rotten Tomatoes.

    There's an outdated assumption that people don't like Dalton, but times have changed. As with Lazenby and OHMSS (once dismissed as a second rate irrelevance) fans and critics have come to appreciate Dalton a lot more. Infact, if you read the reviews, Dalton was getting a lot of positive press even at the time.

    Dalton was the basis for Craig Bond, Dalton did Gritty Bond first, without a doubt a greater appreciation for Dalton since the Craig films. People have gone back and said "I can see what Tim was trying to do there".
  • Posts: 15,430

    Ludovico I could have gone to a bookmaker and put money on anyone on this forum coming back with arguing black was white it would be you.

    Berry and Richards were your typical cast Bond girls, they have always been prominent in the movies. My point is that the whole case now is made up of people and when scripting they are trying to share screen time to keep them all happy. In this Waltz and Seydoux give them loads of screen time absolutely but not have Mallory, Q and MP out in the field and anything more than a few minutes in the film. Because of this it has developed in to a TEAM MI6 thing. That's not really Bond, Bond is a lone wolf.

    You ditch the need to keep a high profile supporting cast, you limit their time on screen it gives you more creative space to focus on Bond, the mission, the villain the over all plot. Rather than "we better make him go back to London again, so that we give Fiennes, Wishaw and Harris some more screen time.

    Old formula

    PTS
    Bond doing
  • Getafix wrote: »

    I think there is an answer to your criticisms - Purvis and Wade. The sooner we see the back of them the better. Whenever plodding cliche makes an appearance in a Bond movie I recognise their signature straight away.

    I agree with a lot of what you say here. Blofeld is a bit of a disappointment in the end, but still, overall it's a decent entry.

    To reiterate, my only problems with the movie stem from the script, it's a beautifully shot, well directed, excellently acted film othwerwise. It's hard to know who to really blame here, Purvis and Wade can certainly be a part of the problem, but I feel the whole "Blofeld is Bond's brother" came from Logan as did the love story.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    Getafix wrote: »

    A lot of people have mentioned to me recently how awful the Brosnan era was. A friend of mine who grew up with Brosnan as Bond could only muster 'GE was pretty good, but that's because of Sean Bean'.

    Look at the Brosnan and Dalton movies on IMDB, Rotten Tomatoes or wherever, and apart from GE all the Brosnan films rank lower than the Dalton films. Even GE ties with LTK on Rotten Tomatoes.

    There's an outdated assumption that people don't like Dalton, but times have changed. As with Lazenby and OHMSS (once dismissed as a second rate irrelevance) fans and critics have come to appreciate Dalton a lot more. Infact, if you read the reviews, Dalton was getting a lot of positive press even at the time.

    You preach to the choir.
    No argument about Dalton here, he's still criminally underrated in rankings :)
  • Posts: 15,430

    Ludovico I could have gone to a bookmaker and put money on anyone on this forum coming back with arguing black was white it would be you.

    Berry and Richards were your typical cast Bond girls, they have always been prominent in the movies. My point is that the whole case now is made up of people and when scripting they are trying to share screen time to keep them all happy. In this Waltz and Seydoux give them loads of screen time absolutely but not have Mallory, Q and MP out in the field and anything more than a few minutes in the film. Because of this it has developed in to a TEAM MI6 thing. That's not really Bond, Bond is a lone wolf.

    You ditch the need to keep a high profile supporting cast, you limit their time on screen it gives you more creative space to focus on Bond, the mission, the villain the over all plot. Rather than "we better make him go back to London again, so that we give Fiennes, Wishaw and Harris some more screen time.

    Old formula

    PTS
    Bond doing
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    I like Brosnan and although I'm not his biggest fan give the guy some credit. I think he gave an honest and fair opinion of what he thought of SP and Craig. Say what you want about his Bond movies but he himself knows his Bond movies were creatively suffocated and I think he's smart enough to know they could have been better. Still, just because his movies weren't FRWL or CR it doesn't mean he can't give an honest assessment on how he feels about the Bond movies after his tenure. It's important to know that he didn't trash the film but only expressed a couple of issues he had with it like everyone of us here and had nothing but praise and support for Craig.
  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    Posts: 4,116

    Ludovico I could have gone to a bookmaker and put money on anyone on this forum coming back with arguing black was white it would be you.

    Berry and Richards were your typical cast Bond girls, they have always been prominent in the movies. My point is that the whole case now is made up of people and when scripting they are trying to share screen time to keep them all happy. In this Waltz and Seydoux give them loads of screen time absolutely but not have Mallory, Q and MP out in the field and anything more than a few minutes in the film. Because of this it has developed in to a TEAM MI6 thing. That's not really Bond, Bond is a lone wolf.

    You ditch the need to keep a high profile supporting cast, you limit their time on screen it gives you more creative space to focus on Bond, the mission, the villain the over all plot. Rather than "we better make him go back to London again, so that we give Fiennes, Wishaw and Harris some more screen time.

    Old formula

    PTS
    Bond doing something at his leisure before being summoned to HQ
    MP - A few minutes flirting
    M - 5 to 10 minutes tops "here is your mission report to Q branch in the morning/now"
    Q - 5 minutes - "Here is what I have for you 007"
    Bond arriving in some far off location, investigating
    Bond Meets the main Bond girl of the movie, likely using her to get to someone else
    Car chase
    A twist
    Second Exotic Location
    A second girl
    A showdown and gun fight
    Bond 1 on 1 with the villain
    MP - final flirt a few minutes
    M - Congratulation - a few minutes

    I don't mind it cutting back to London showing M in meeting with ministers or official is it is pertinent to the story. Those aspects have been around from Connery films. Just not central to the action or helping Bond do his job in the field.

    We have gone from the UK supporting cast being in the film for 20 minutes to them featuring in most of the films. It started with Dame Judi - "Oh we have Dame Judi, we better use her more than we did any previous M and it has just grown arms and legs it didn't matter where he went she would show up, right through Brosnan and now Craig, I thought when they did away with her in Skyfall all of it would stop, but it was worse in Spectre.

    Bond 25 give me William Boyd - Solo, just so I can see Bond solo aga
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,629
    dragonsky wrote: »
    Interesting comment I found on youtube:


    This is just a thought, but could the villians of the Daniel Graig James Bond films represent the Seven Deadly Sins?
    Casino Royale: Le Chiffre = Greed (banker of the underworld)
    Quantum of Solace; Greene = Gluttony (wants the watersupply of Bolivia)
    Skyfall: Silvia = Wrath (wants revenge on MI6 and M)
    spectre: Blofeld = Pride ('i am the author of all your pain' (or something like that), he sees himself above Bond, which you could say 'pride').

    What is left: Envy, Lust and Sloth.

    Interesting indeed.
  • Posts: 5,767
    Getafix wrote: »
    I think there is an answer to your criticisms - Purvis and Wade. The sooner we see the back of them the better. Whenever plodding cliche makes an appearance in a Bond movie I recognise their signature straight away.
    There have been much sillier scripts made into much more entertaining Bond films, so P&W are the smallest problem, if at all.

  • Posts: 11,425
    boldfinger wrote: »
    There have been much sillier scripts made into much more entertaining Bond films, so P&W are the smallest problem, if at all.

    I always feel there's a plodding dead-weight to the films almost whenever P+W are involved.
  • Posts: 5,767
    Getafix wrote: »

    I always feel there's a plodding dead-weight to the films almost whenever P+W are involved.
    Perhaps, but they still remain the smallest problem ;-).

  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,995
    This is really strange... I want to know it I'm the only one.
    During the film, in the scenes in the compound in the meteor crater, I never ONCE though about YOLT's volcano lair. In fact, NO OTHER Bond film came to mind at all during my viewing. I was just so in the moment with the movie.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    chrisisall wrote: »
    This is really strange... I want to know it I'm the only one.
    During the film, in the scenes in the compound in the meteor crater, I never ONCE though about YOLT's volcano lair. In fact, NO OTHER Bond film came to mind at all during my viewing. I was just so in the moment with the movie.

    I thought, as with a lot of the film, there were allusions to the mythos but done in a brilliant way. If you'd told me on paper they were riffing on the volcano lair I'd have hated it, but in reality it's bloody perfect and I love the theatricality of the meteor exposition. Straight out of a Fleming novel.
  • royale65royale65 Caustic misanthrope reporting for duty.
    edited November 2015 Posts: 4,423
    In the scene where Bond and Dr. Swann are examining the meteoric, with the disembodied voice of ESB I was reminded of Dr. No's tarantula room. There's even a skylight similar to the wonderful Ken Adam set. And what with Bond and Swann arriving to their rooms, with their clothes laid out, I felt a very Dr. No type of vibe.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,995
    royale65 wrote: »
    In the scene where Bond and Dr. Swann are examining the meteoric, with the disembodied voice of ESB I was reminded of Dr. No's tarantula room. There's even a skylight similar to the wonderful Ken Adam set.
    I got a very familiar Bond feel during that, but didn't consciously make the connection then.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    chrisisall wrote: »
    I got a very familiar Bond feel during that, but didn't consciously make the connection then.

    Which is why it's so good imo. It combines ingredients that feel Bondian, but it isn't a straight rip off.
  • Posts: 11,425
    I was largely pretty happy with how the film looked.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    RC7 wrote: »

    Which is why it's so good imo. It combines ingredients that feel Bondian, but it isn't a straight rip off.

    Exactly, SP just nails it!
  • Posts: 2,152
    Saw SPECTRE again last night and actually enjoyed it quite a bit more. Sometimes on a first viewing there's almost too much to take in. Much in this film references previous films. A lot felt familiar, but in a new way. Meteorite room is definitely a reminder of Dent waiting for orders from Dr. No. Train fight, expanded FRWL. White cat and "Hello, Pussy."
    But also Lawrence of Arabia, Casablanca, Touch of Evil, etc. So many, a separate thread might serve better.

    But a couple of quibbles, as there always seems to be in a Bond film. Not sure how much time passed between blowing up ESB's fortress and Bond arriving at the bombed out
    MI6 building. I assume very little, since Blofeld wasn't even wearing a bandage over that nasty wound. It's the red strings in the MI6 building that bother me. Who rigged them up and when? How long did it take? Also, what was the purpose of the net inside the building? I realize one should never think too hard about a Bond, but sometimes the little things rankle.





  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited November 2015 Posts: 17,995
    CrabKey wrote: »
    Also, what was the purpose of the net inside the building?
    That's a standard net they use in buildings with missing floors & rubble about to protect workers from falling debris on the site. When Bond jumped I'd forgotten we'd seen it just minutes before and I realized what a genius he really is. \m/
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    @CrabKey

    The building was prepared by the city to be blown up controlled.
    Those are the many red cables.
    The net was there for safety reasons.
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