No Time to Die production thread

11511521541561571208

Comments

  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    edited July 2019 Posts: 3,126
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Can we have a discussion page for the people who are excited about everything they're doing with Bond 25?

    The Bond25 echo chamber thread? ;)
    If that's what it takes. I'm all for alternative opinions but this beyond just an opinion. This has gotten to the point where people are presenting opinions as facts. People seemed to have already decided Nomi being 007 for a whoever much of the film will not work and is just a gimmick before they've even seen the film and seen the idea in context.

    Welcome to the world where everyone has different opinions. Whether you agree with them or not.
    I'm very used to it but when someone who compares the use of a black actress as the new 007 to a cheap, over-the-top stunt in a crappy James Bond film, that doesn't feel like an opinion, just more of an insult.

    There is much more that can go wrong with this movie than this. Waltz returning is more problematic for the franchise than this little codename change, which might not even be permanent by the end of the film. At least this piece of information got people interested and will probably get way more bums on seats, whereas Waltz returning generated hardly any buzz. People didn't really care.

    @Denbigh Because maybe that it is a gimmick people can have different opinions
    ...but what people aren't seeing is that in modern film industry, James Bond isn't as important to the general public.

    The film industry is a business so of course they're gonna make these kind of decisions, but is that unbelievable to think that the producers and writers worked in harmony to create something that felt good for the story and also appealing to audiences that may not have necessarily gone to see Bond 25 in the first place. The more successful this film is, the more Bond films they can make. Just because you're turned of by it, you're still gonna see the film and maybe others will to, and who knows you might enjoy the idea in context.

    I'm always up for people's opinions, but this stuff regarding the 007 codename being given to a black woman for ONE movie, is really not enough to write off the film already.

    @Denbigh aren't we the ones that fill their pockets and if it's not important why keep making movies sell the thing to Disney or Universal then. As long as it makes sense to the plot and they do it in a respectful way and he gets his number back I'm fine.
  • Posts: 152
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Eon can't win. If they do something new, you riot. If they don't, you still riot.

    At least I'm gonna enjoy Bond 25 :D

    Exactly!!
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited July 2019 Posts: 5,970
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Can we have a discussion page for the people who are excited about everything they're doing with Bond 25?

    The Bond25 echo chamber thread? ;)
    If that's what it takes. I'm all for alternative opinions but this beyond just an opinion. This has gotten to the point where people are presenting opinions as facts. People seemed to have already decided Nomi being 007 for a whoever much of the film will not work and is just a gimmick before they've even seen the film and seen the idea in context.

    Welcome to the world where everyone has different opinions. Whether you agree with them or not.
    I'm very used to it but when someone who compares the use of a black actress as the new 007 to a cheap, over-the-top stunt in a crappy James Bond film, that doesn't feel like an opinion, just more of an insult.

    There is much more that can go wrong with this movie than this. Waltz returning is more problematic for the franchise than this little codename change, which might not even be permanent by the end of the film. At least this piece of information got people interested and will probably get way more bums on seats, whereas Waltz returning generated hardly any buzz. People didn't really care.

    @Denbigh Because maybe that it is a gimmick people can have different opinions
    ...but what people aren't seeing is that in modern film industry, James Bond isn't as important to the general public.

    The film industry is a business so of course they're gonna make these kind of decisions, but is that unbelievable to think that the producers and writers worked in harmony to create something that felt good for the story and also appealing to audiences that may not have necessarily gone to see Bond 25 in the first place. The more successful this film is, the more Bond films they can make. Just because you're turned of by it, you're still gonna see the film and maybe others will to, and who knows you might enjoy the idea in context.

    I'm always up for people's opinions, but this stuff regarding the 007 codename being given to a black woman for ONE movie, is really not enough to write off the film already.

    @Denbigh aren't we the ones that fill their pockets and if it's not important why keep making movies sell the thing to Disney or Universal then.
    Because the things still make money and are important to a lot of people, but as the film industry changes, the Bond franchise interest levels with people has dropped and are not doing as well as more popular franchises. Yes, Skyfall was really successful but that was in 2012 only two years after the proper start to the MCU and the industry has changed massively since then.

    But also If you compare casting news of a Bond film to a Marvel or DC film, the latter will always gather a bigger interest because its not just huge Marvel/DC fans, its the general public.

    So the Bond franchise needs to practise what it preaches and change with the times. ONCE AGAIN if a 00 agent quits in a modern-day world, specifically 2019/2020, the new replacement has an equal chance of being a man or a woman, and if when writing the script and considering changing the franchise, it makes sense that the new 007 would be a woman then bloody well do it and create some buzz and interesting character motivations and dynamics.

    If they wanna get people to watch, they can't keep doing the same stuff. Spectre was 2 hours of homage, so why not make the follow-up as original as possible.
  • Posts: 11,425
    It also incontrovertibly puts to bed the codename theory. 007 is a number that can be assigned to anyone but James Bond is not a code name.

  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    edited July 2019 Posts: 3,126
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Can we have a discussion page for the people who are excited about everything they're doing with Bond 25?

    The Bond25 echo chamber thread? ;)
    If that's what it takes. I'm all for alternative opinions but this beyond just an opinion. This has gotten to the point where people are presenting opinions as facts. People seemed to have already decided Nomi being 007 for a whoever much of the film will not work and is just a gimmick before they've even seen the film and seen the idea in context.

    Welcome to the world where everyone has different opinions. Whether you agree with them or not.
    I'm very used to it but when someone who compares the use of a black actress as the new 007 to a cheap, over-the-top stunt in a crappy James Bond film, that doesn't feel like an opinion, just more of an insult.

    There is much more that can go wrong with this movie than this. Waltz returning is more problematic for the franchise than this little codename change, which might not even be permanent by the end of the film. At least this piece of information got people interested and will probably get way more bums on seats, whereas Waltz returning generated hardly any buzz. People didn't really care.

    @Denbigh Because maybe that it is a gimmick people can have different opinions
    ...but what people aren't seeing is that in modern film industry, James Bond isn't as important to the general public.

    The film industry is a business so of course they're gonna make these kind of decisions, but is that unbelievable to think that the producers and writers worked in harmony to create something that felt good for the story and also appealing to audiences that may not have necessarily gone to see Bond 25 in the first place. The more successful this film is, the more Bond films they can make. Just because you're turned of by it, you're still gonna see the film and maybe others will to, and who knows you might enjoy the idea in context.

    I'm always up for people's opinions, but this stuff regarding the 007 codename being given to a black woman for ONE movie, is really not enough to write off the film already.

    @Denbigh aren't we the ones that fill their pockets and if it's not important why keep making movies sell the thing to Disney or Universal then.
    Because the things still make money and are important to a lot of people, but as the film industry changes, the Bond franchise interest levels with people has dropped and are not doing as well as more popular franchises. Yes, Skyfall was really successful but that was in 2012 only two years after the proper start to the MCU and the industry has changed massively since then.

    But also If you compare casting news of a Bond film to a Marvel or DC film, the latter will always gather a bigger interest because its not just huge Marvel/DC fans, its the general public.

    So the Bond franchise needs to practise what it preaches and change with the times. ONCE AGAIN if a 00 agent quits in a modern-day world, specifically 2019/2020, the new replacement has an equal chance of being a man or a woman, and if when writing the script and considering changing the franchise, it makes sense that the new 007 would be a woman then bloody well do it and create some buzz and interesting character motivations and dynamics.

    If they wanna get people to watch, they can't keep doing the same stuff. Spectre was 2 hours of homage, so why not make the follow-up as original as possible.

    @Denbigh can't they think of anything creative then use politics to sell tickets no imagination the reason they sell tickets is they trick people to believe things and then they force people to believe what they say and if you don't join in they make your life miserable. Like there are better ways like create a new secret agent to try to out duel Bond like the whole 009 thing from Spectre.
  • duke_togoduke_togo france
    edited July 2019 Posts: 138
    deleted
  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    edited July 2019 Posts: 3,126
    I didn't want this to turn political but this whole idea of "007" has become a point where things go too far I guess there isn't.
  • Posts: 503
    Getafix wrote: »
    It also incontrovertibly puts to bed the codename theory. 007 is a number that can be assigned to anyone but James Bond is not a code name.
    Well technically all it does is decouple 007 from James Bond, it doesn't mean James Bond isn't still a codename. It's a pretty generic name after all, and you still have to account for how 6 different actors have portrayed the identically-named person spanning the 1960s to the 2020s.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited July 2019 Posts: 5,970
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Can we have a discussion page for the people who are excited about everything they're doing with Bond 25?

    The Bond25 echo chamber thread? ;)
    If that's what it takes. I'm all for alternative opinions but this beyond just an opinion. This has gotten to the point where people are presenting opinions as facts. People seemed to have already decided Nomi being 007 for a whoever much of the film will not work and is just a gimmick before they've even seen the film and seen the idea in context.

    Welcome to the world where everyone has different opinions. Whether you agree with them or not.
    I'm very used to it but when someone who compares the use of a black actress as the new 007 to a cheap, over-the-top stunt in a crappy James Bond film, that doesn't feel like an opinion, just more of an insult.

    There is much more that can go wrong with this movie than this. Waltz returning is more problematic for the franchise than this little codename change, which might not even be permanent by the end of the film. At least this piece of information got people interested and will probably get way more bums on seats, whereas Waltz returning generated hardly any buzz. People didn't really care.

    @Denbigh Because maybe that it is a gimmick people can have different opinions
    ...but what people aren't seeing is that in modern film industry, James Bond isn't as important to the general public.

    The film industry is a business so of course they're gonna make these kind of decisions, but is that unbelievable to think that the producers and writers worked in harmony to create something that felt good for the story and also appealing to audiences that may not have necessarily gone to see Bond 25 in the first place. The more successful this film is, the more Bond films they can make. Just because you're turned of by it, you're still gonna see the film and maybe others will to, and who knows you might enjoy the idea in context.

    I'm always up for people's opinions, but this stuff regarding the 007 codename being given to a black woman for ONE movie, is really not enough to write off the film already.

    @Denbigh aren't we the ones that fill their pockets and if it's not important why keep making movies sell the thing to Disney or Universal then.
    Because the things still make money and are important to a lot of people, but as the film industry changes, the Bond franchise interest levels with people has dropped and are not doing as well as more popular franchises. Yes, Skyfall was really successful but that was in 2012 only two years after the proper start to the MCU and the industry has changed massively since then.

    But also If you compare casting news of a Bond film to a Marvel or DC film, the latter will always gather a bigger interest because its not just huge Marvel/DC fans, its the general public.

    So the Bond franchise needs to practise what it preaches and change with the times. ONCE AGAIN if a 00 agent quits in a modern-day world, specifically 2019/2020, the new replacement has an equal chance of being a man or a woman, and if when writing the script and considering changing the franchise, it makes sense that the new 007 would be a woman then bloody well do it and create some buzz and interesting character motivations and dynamics.

    If they wanna get people to watch, they can't keep doing the same stuff. Spectre was 2 hours of homage, so why not make the follow-up as original as possible.

    @Denbigh can't they think of anything creative then use politics to sell tickets no imagination like there are better ways like create a new secret agent to try to out duel Bond like the whole 009 thing from Spectre.
    I'm sorry to get all political myself but you can't just say a woman can't play this part because of "politics", because it's giving in to the SJW blah blah blah.

    That's like saying "You shouldn't make Black Panther because of politics. You're just making a black superhero film because you're just trying to introduce more black characters into film so that you can sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and culture in a film doesn't have to be considered politics.

    "Oh no this woman can't play a role that narratively any gender could play because that's just the effect of SJW's and people wanting a black/female James Bond. Again, using politics to sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and gender in a film doesn't have to be politics.

    How are we meant to progress and move forward if people don't make decisions that are going to help progress and move forward whether you like it or not.
  • Posts: 11,425
    They are pushing the boundaries with this film. No issues with that as long as its well done.

    I personally would have liked to just see a classic Bond mission during the Craig era. We never got it. But anyone still carping on about that hasn't realised Craig Bond is never going down that road.
  • Posts: 4,044
    Bond wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    It also incontrovertibly puts to bed the codename theory. 007 is a number that can be assigned to anyone but James Bond is not a code name.
    Well technically all it does is decouple 007 from James Bond, it doesn't mean James Bond isn't still a codename. It's a pretty generic name after all, and you still have to account for how 6 different actors have portrayed the identically-named person spanning the 1960s to the 2020s.

    They are actors playing a part in a movie.
  • Posts: 11,425
    vzok wrote: »
    Bond wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    It also incontrovertibly puts to bed the codename theory. 007 is a number that can be assigned to anyone but James Bond is not a code name.
    Well technically all it does is decouple 007 from James Bond, it doesn't mean James Bond isn't still a codename. It's a pretty generic name after all, and you still have to account for how 6 different actors have portrayed the identically-named person spanning the 1960s to the 2020s.

    They are actors playing a part in a movie.

    Exactly.
  • Posts: 503
    vzok wrote: »
    Bond wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    It also incontrovertibly puts to bed the codename theory. 007 is a number that can be assigned to anyone but James Bond is not a code name.
    Well technically all it does is decouple 007 from James Bond, it doesn't mean James Bond isn't still a codename. It's a pretty generic name after all, and you still have to account for how 6 different actors have portrayed the identically-named person spanning the 1960s to the 2020s.

    They are actors playing a part in a movie.

    So we just ignore the timeline issue? The Bond living in 1962 and surrounded by its signifying elements is the same person as the Bond living in 2020?
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,410
    Getafix wrote: »
    They are pushing the boundaries with this film. No issues with that as long as its well done.

    I personally would have liked to just see a classic Bond mission during the Craig era. We never got it. But anyone still carping on about that hasn't realised Craig Bond is never going down that road.

    Exactly which is why it's really important that they bring back that sense of familiarity after Bond 25. This movie can be a weird, messy experiment and it will still have some who enjoy it. Then they can bring back the old Bond, and others will be over the moon. That way everyone kinda gets what they want.
  • Posts: 16,170
    vzok wrote: »
    Bond wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    It also incontrovertibly puts to bed the codename theory. 007 is a number that can be assigned to anyone but James Bond is not a code name.
    Well technically all it does is decouple 007 from James Bond, it doesn't mean James Bond isn't still a codename. It's a pretty generic name after all, and you still have to account for how 6 different actors have portrayed the identically-named person spanning the 1960s to the 2020s.

    They are actors playing a part in a movie.

    Precisely. Just like there's been actors playing Bruce Wayne from 1940's-2020's yet no one whines and tries to justify it with some code-name bull.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited July 2019 Posts: 5,970
    Bond wrote: »
    vzok wrote: »
    Bond wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    It also incontrovertibly puts to bed the codename theory. 007 is a number that can be assigned to anyone but James Bond is not a code name.
    Well technically all it does is decouple 007 from James Bond, it doesn't mean James Bond isn't still a codename. It's a pretty generic name after all, and you still have to account for how 6 different actors have portrayed the identically-named person spanning the 1960s to the 2020s.

    They are actors playing a part in a movie.

    So we just ignore the timeline issue? The Bond living in 1962 and surrounded by its signifying elements is the same person as the Bond living in 2020?
    Is it that hard to suspend your disbelief? and either way, Daniel's Bond is seperate from all the ones that came before anyway?
  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    edited July 2019 Posts: 3,126
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Can we have a discussion page for the people who are excited about everything they're doing with Bond 25?

    The Bond25 echo chamber thread? ;)
    If that's what it takes. I'm all for alternative opinions but this beyond just an opinion. This has gotten to the point where people are presenting opinions as facts. People seemed to have already decided Nomi being 007 for a whoever much of the film will not work and is just a gimmick before they've even seen the film and seen the idea in context.

    Welcome to the world where everyone has different opinions. Whether you agree with them or not.
    I'm very used to it but when someone who compares the use of a black actress as the new 007 to a cheap, over-the-top stunt in a crappy James Bond film, that doesn't feel like an opinion, just more of an insult.

    There is much more that can go wrong with this movie than this. Waltz returning is more problematic for the franchise than this little codename change, which might not even be permanent by the end of the film. At least this piece of information got people interested and will probably get way more bums on seats, whereas Waltz returning generated hardly any buzz. People didn't really care.

    @Denbigh Because maybe that it is a gimmick people can have different opinions
    ...but what people aren't seeing is that in modern film industry, James Bond isn't as important to the general public.

    The film industry is a business so of course they're gonna make these kind of decisions, but is that unbelievable to think that the producers and writers worked in harmony to create something that felt good for the story and also appealing to audiences that may not have necessarily gone to see Bond 25 in the first place. The more successful this film is, the more Bond films they can make. Just because you're turned of by it, you're still gonna see the film and maybe others will to, and who knows you might enjoy the idea in context.

    I'm always up for people's opinions, but this stuff regarding the 007 codename being given to a black woman for ONE movie, is really not enough to write off the film already.

    @Denbigh aren't we the ones that fill their pockets and if it's not important why keep making movies sell the thing to Disney or Universal then.
    Because the things still make money and are important to a lot of people, but as the film industry changes, the Bond franchise interest levels with people has dropped and are not doing as well as more popular franchises. Yes, Skyfall was really successful but that was in 2012 only two years after the proper start to the MCU and the industry has changed massively since then.

    But also If you compare casting news of a Bond film to a Marvel or DC film, the latter will always gather a bigger interest because its not just huge Marvel/DC fans, its the general public.

    So the Bond franchise needs to practise what it preaches and change with the times. ONCE AGAIN if a 00 agent quits in a modern-day world, specifically 2019/2020, the new replacement has an equal chance of being a man or a woman, and if when writing the script and considering changing the franchise, it makes sense that the new 007 would be a woman then bloody well do it and create some buzz and interesting character motivations and dynamics.

    If they wanna get people to watch, they can't keep doing the same stuff. Spectre was 2 hours of homage, so why not make the follow-up as original as possible.

    @Denbigh can't they think of anything creative then use politics to sell tickets no imagination like there are better ways like create a new secret agent to try to out duel Bond like the whole 009 thing from Spectre.
    I'm sorry to get all political myself but you can't just say a woman can't play this part because of "politics", because it's giving in to the SJW blah blah blah.

    That's like saying "You shouldn't make Black Panther because of politics. You're just making a black superhero film because you're just trying to introduce more black characters into film so that you can sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and culture in a film doesn't have to be considered politics.

    "Oh no this woman can't play a role that narratively any gender could play because that's just the effect of SJW's and people wanting a black/female James Bond. Again, using politics to sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and gender in a film doesn't have to be politics.

    How are we meant to progress and move forward if people don't make decisions that are going to help progress and move forward whether you like it or not.

    @Denbigh if you want progress change all the genders of characters like and race and see how you much sense is "left". Instead of making new characters and not cheapening the established ones.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited July 2019 Posts: 5,970
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Can we have a discussion page for the people who are excited about everything they're doing with Bond 25?

    The Bond25 echo chamber thread? ;)
    If that's what it takes. I'm all for alternative opinions but this beyond just an opinion. This has gotten to the point where people are presenting opinions as facts. People seemed to have already decided Nomi being 007 for a whoever much of the film will not work and is just a gimmick before they've even seen the film and seen the idea in context.

    Welcome to the world where everyone has different opinions. Whether you agree with them or not.
    I'm very used to it but when someone who compares the use of a black actress as the new 007 to a cheap, over-the-top stunt in a crappy James Bond film, that doesn't feel like an opinion, just more of an insult.

    There is much more that can go wrong with this movie than this. Waltz returning is more problematic for the franchise than this little codename change, which might not even be permanent by the end of the film. At least this piece of information got people interested and will probably get way more bums on seats, whereas Waltz returning generated hardly any buzz. People didn't really care.

    @Denbigh Because maybe that it is a gimmick people can have different opinions
    ...but what people aren't seeing is that in modern film industry, James Bond isn't as important to the general public.

    The film industry is a business so of course they're gonna make these kind of decisions, but is that unbelievable to think that the producers and writers worked in harmony to create something that felt good for the story and also appealing to audiences that may not have necessarily gone to see Bond 25 in the first place. The more successful this film is, the more Bond films they can make. Just because you're turned of by it, you're still gonna see the film and maybe others will to, and who knows you might enjoy the idea in context.

    I'm always up for people's opinions, but this stuff regarding the 007 codename being given to a black woman for ONE movie, is really not enough to write off the film already.

    @Denbigh aren't we the ones that fill their pockets and if it's not important why keep making movies sell the thing to Disney or Universal then.
    Because the things still make money and are important to a lot of people, but as the film industry changes, the Bond franchise interest levels with people has dropped and are not doing as well as more popular franchises. Yes, Skyfall was really successful but that was in 2012 only two years after the proper start to the MCU and the industry has changed massively since then.

    But also If you compare casting news of a Bond film to a Marvel or DC film, the latter will always gather a bigger interest because its not just huge Marvel/DC fans, its the general public.

    So the Bond franchise needs to practise what it preaches and change with the times. ONCE AGAIN if a 00 agent quits in a modern-day world, specifically 2019/2020, the new replacement has an equal chance of being a man or a woman, and if when writing the script and considering changing the franchise, it makes sense that the new 007 would be a woman then bloody well do it and create some buzz and interesting character motivations and dynamics.

    If they wanna get people to watch, they can't keep doing the same stuff. Spectre was 2 hours of homage, so why not make the follow-up as original as possible.

    @Denbigh can't they think of anything creative then use politics to sell tickets no imagination like there are better ways like create a new secret agent to try to out duel Bond like the whole 009 thing from Spectre.
    I'm sorry to get all political myself but you can't just say a woman can't play this part because of "politics", because it's giving in to the SJW blah blah blah.

    That's like saying "You shouldn't make Black Panther because of politics. You're just making a black superhero film because you're just trying to introduce more black characters into film so that you can sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and culture in a film doesn't have to be considered politics.

    "Oh no this woman can't play a role that narratively any gender could play because that's just the effect of SJW's and people wanting a black/female James Bond. Again, using politics to sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and gender in a film doesn't have to be politics.

    How are we meant to progress and move forward if people don't make decisions that are going to help progress and move forward whether you like it or not.

    @Denbigh if you want progress change change all the genders of characters like and race and see how you much sense is left.

    That's not even an argument for what you're trying to say. You're just ridiculously hypothesising.

    James Bond without the codename is still James Bond.

    Nothing about him as a person changes when you remove his codename.
  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    Posts: 3,126
    Bond wrote: »
    vzok wrote: »
    Bond wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    It also incontrovertibly puts to bed the codename theory. 007 is a number that can be assigned to anyone but James Bond is not a code name.
    Well technically all it does is decouple 007 from James Bond, it doesn't mean James Bond isn't still a codename. It's a pretty generic name after all, and you still have to account for how 6 different actors have portrayed the identically-named person spanning the 1960s to the 2020s.

    They are actors playing a part in a movie.

    So we just ignore the timeline issue? The Bond living in 1962 and surrounded by its signifying elements is the same person as the Bond living in 2020?

    Bond is the same character but in a different world. Look I'm for change but sometimes change goes too far for my liking and certain things need to stay the same or things fall apart.
  • HildebrandRarityHildebrandRarity Centre international d'assistance aux personnes déplacées, Paris, France
    Posts: 484
    007 is not part of Bond's identity. It's mostly part of the marketing.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    Posts: 5,970
    007 is not part of Bond's identity. It's mostly part of the marketing.
    +1
  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    Posts: 3,126
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Can we have a discussion page for the people who are excited about everything they're doing with Bond 25?

    The Bond25 echo chamber thread? ;)
    If that's what it takes. I'm all for alternative opinions but this beyond just an opinion. This has gotten to the point where people are presenting opinions as facts. People seemed to have already decided Nomi being 007 for a whoever much of the film will not work and is just a gimmick before they've even seen the film and seen the idea in context.

    Welcome to the world where everyone has different opinions. Whether you agree with them or not.
    I'm very used to it but when someone who compares the use of a black actress as the new 007 to a cheap, over-the-top stunt in a crappy James Bond film, that doesn't feel like an opinion, just more of an insult.

    There is much more that can go wrong with this movie than this. Waltz returning is more problematic for the franchise than this little codename change, which might not even be permanent by the end of the film. At least this piece of information got people interested and will probably get way more bums on seats, whereas Waltz returning generated hardly any buzz. People didn't really care.

    @Denbigh Because maybe that it is a gimmick people can have different opinions
    ...but what people aren't seeing is that in modern film industry, James Bond isn't as important to the general public.

    The film industry is a business so of course they're gonna make these kind of decisions, but is that unbelievable to think that the producers and writers worked in harmony to create something that felt good for the story and also appealing to audiences that may not have necessarily gone to see Bond 25 in the first place. The more successful this film is, the more Bond films they can make. Just because you're turned of by it, you're still gonna see the film and maybe others will to, and who knows you might enjoy the idea in context.

    I'm always up for people's opinions, but this stuff regarding the 007 codename being given to a black woman for ONE movie, is really not enough to write off the film already.

    @Denbigh aren't we the ones that fill their pockets and if it's not important why keep making movies sell the thing to Disney or Universal then.
    Because the things still make money and are important to a lot of people, but as the film industry changes, the Bond franchise interest levels with people has dropped and are not doing as well as more popular franchises. Yes, Skyfall was really successful but that was in 2012 only two years after the proper start to the MCU and the industry has changed massively since then.

    But also If you compare casting news of a Bond film to a Marvel or DC film, the latter will always gather a bigger interest because its not just huge Marvel/DC fans, its the general public.

    So the Bond franchise needs to practise what it preaches and change with the times. ONCE AGAIN if a 00 agent quits in a modern-day world, specifically 2019/2020, the new replacement has an equal chance of being a man or a woman, and if when writing the script and considering changing the franchise, it makes sense that the new 007 would be a woman then bloody well do it and create some buzz and interesting character motivations and dynamics.

    If they wanna get people to watch, they can't keep doing the same stuff. Spectre was 2 hours of homage, so why not make the follow-up as original as possible.

    @Denbigh can't they think of anything creative then use politics to sell tickets no imagination like there are better ways like create a new secret agent to try to out duel Bond like the whole 009 thing from Spectre.
    I'm sorry to get all political myself but you can't just say a woman can't play this part because of "politics", because it's giving in to the SJW blah blah blah.

    That's like saying "You shouldn't make Black Panther because of politics. You're just making a black superhero film because you're just trying to introduce more black characters into film so that you can sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and culture in a film doesn't have to be considered politics.

    "Oh no this woman can't play a role that narratively any gender could play because that's just the effect of SJW's and people wanting a black/female James Bond. Again, using politics to sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and gender in a film doesn't have to be politics.

    How are we meant to progress and move forward if people don't make decisions that are going to help progress and move forward whether you like it or not.

    @Denbigh if you want progress change change all the genders of characters like and race and see how you much sense is left.

    That's not even an argument for what you're trying to say. You're just ridiculously hypothesising.

    James Bond without the codename is still James Bond.

    Nothing about him as a person changes when you remove his codename.

    @Denbigh you talked about black panther what if we made Black panther white oh that's not right is it I guess it is or let's make wonder women a man now men are relevant. Thanks for trying to trick me and change things up didn't work.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited July 2019 Posts: 5,970
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Can we have a discussion page for the people who are excited about everything they're doing with Bond 25?

    The Bond25 echo chamber thread? ;)
    If that's what it takes. I'm all for alternative opinions but this beyond just an opinion. This has gotten to the point where people are presenting opinions as facts. People seemed to have already decided Nomi being 007 for a whoever much of the film will not work and is just a gimmick before they've even seen the film and seen the idea in context.

    Welcome to the world where everyone has different opinions. Whether you agree with them or not.
    I'm very used to it but when someone who compares the use of a black actress as the new 007 to a cheap, over-the-top stunt in a crappy James Bond film, that doesn't feel like an opinion, just more of an insult.

    There is much more that can go wrong with this movie than this. Waltz returning is more problematic for the franchise than this little codename change, which might not even be permanent by the end of the film. At least this piece of information got people interested and will probably get way more bums on seats, whereas Waltz returning generated hardly any buzz. People didn't really care.

    @Denbigh Because maybe that it is a gimmick people can have different opinions
    ...but what people aren't seeing is that in modern film industry, James Bond isn't as important to the general public.

    The film industry is a business so of course they're gonna make these kind of decisions, but is that unbelievable to think that the producers and writers worked in harmony to create something that felt good for the story and also appealing to audiences that may not have necessarily gone to see Bond 25 in the first place. The more successful this film is, the more Bond films they can make. Just because you're turned of by it, you're still gonna see the film and maybe others will to, and who knows you might enjoy the idea in context.

    I'm always up for people's opinions, but this stuff regarding the 007 codename being given to a black woman for ONE movie, is really not enough to write off the film already.

    @Denbigh aren't we the ones that fill their pockets and if it's not important why keep making movies sell the thing to Disney or Universal then.
    Because the things still make money and are important to a lot of people, but as the film industry changes, the Bond franchise interest levels with people has dropped and are not doing as well as more popular franchises. Yes, Skyfall was really successful but that was in 2012 only two years after the proper start to the MCU and the industry has changed massively since then.

    But also If you compare casting news of a Bond film to a Marvel or DC film, the latter will always gather a bigger interest because its not just huge Marvel/DC fans, its the general public.

    So the Bond franchise needs to practise what it preaches and change with the times. ONCE AGAIN if a 00 agent quits in a modern-day world, specifically 2019/2020, the new replacement has an equal chance of being a man or a woman, and if when writing the script and considering changing the franchise, it makes sense that the new 007 would be a woman then bloody well do it and create some buzz and interesting character motivations and dynamics.

    If they wanna get people to watch, they can't keep doing the same stuff. Spectre was 2 hours of homage, so why not make the follow-up as original as possible.

    @Denbigh can't they think of anything creative then use politics to sell tickets no imagination like there are better ways like create a new secret agent to try to out duel Bond like the whole 009 thing from Spectre.
    I'm sorry to get all political myself but you can't just say a woman can't play this part because of "politics", because it's giving in to the SJW blah blah blah.

    That's like saying "You shouldn't make Black Panther because of politics. You're just making a black superhero film because you're just trying to introduce more black characters into film so that you can sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and culture in a film doesn't have to be considered politics.

    "Oh no this woman can't play a role that narratively any gender could play because that's just the effect of SJW's and people wanting a black/female James Bond. Again, using politics to sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and gender in a film doesn't have to be politics.

    How are we meant to progress and move forward if people don't make decisions that are going to help progress and move forward whether you like it or not.

    @Denbigh if you want progress change change all the genders of characters like and race and see how you much sense is left.

    That's not even an argument for what you're trying to say. You're just ridiculously hypothesising.

    James Bond without the codename is still James Bond.

    Nothing about him as a person changes when you remove his codename.

    @Denbigh you talked about black panther what if we made Black panther white oh that's not right is it I guess it is or let's make wonder women a man now men are relevant. Thanks for trying to trick me and change things up didn't work.
    But that doesn't apply. This isn't changing the gender of a well-known character. James Bond isn't going to be a black woman in this film. No fundamentals about his character have changed. His famous line is "Bond, James Bond" not "7, 007."

    He's going to be a muscled, blonde man called Daniel Craig. Nomi is her own character and has just gotten a realistic promotion into an empty position, and I'm not trying to trick you, I'm just using evidence of other properties to show that not everything has to be a "bad idea with a political agenda".
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,218
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Can we have a discussion page for the people who are excited about everything they're doing with Bond 25?

    The Bond25 echo chamber thread? ;)
    If that's what it takes. I'm all for alternative opinions but this beyond just an opinion. This has gotten to the point where people are presenting opinions as facts. People seemed to have already decided Nomi being 007 for a whoever much of the film will not work and is just a gimmick before they've even seen the film and seen the idea in context.

    Welcome to the world where everyone has different opinions. Whether you agree with them or not.
    I'm very used to it but when someone who compares the use of a black actress as the new 007 to a cheap, over-the-top stunt in a crappy James Bond film, that doesn't feel like an opinion, just more of an insult.

    There is much more that can go wrong with this movie than this. Waltz returning is more problematic for the franchise than this little codename change, which might not even be permanent by the end of the film. At least this piece of information got people interested and will probably get way more bums on seats, whereas Waltz returning generated hardly any buzz. People didn't really care.

    @Denbigh Because maybe that it is a gimmick people can have different opinions
    ...but what people aren't seeing is that in modern film industry, James Bond isn't as important to the general public.

    The film industry is a business so of course they're gonna make these kind of decisions, but is that unbelievable to think that the producers and writers worked in harmony to create something that felt good for the story and also appealing to audiences that may not have necessarily gone to see Bond 25 in the first place. The more successful this film is, the more Bond films they can make. Just because you're turned of by it, you're still gonna see the film and maybe others will to, and who knows you might enjoy the idea in context.

    I'm always up for people's opinions, but this stuff regarding the 007 codename being given to a black woman for ONE movie, is really not enough to write off the film already.

    @Denbigh aren't we the ones that fill their pockets and if it's not important why keep making movies sell the thing to Disney or Universal then.
    Because the things still make money and are important to a lot of people, but as the film industry changes, the Bond franchise interest levels with people has dropped and are not doing as well as more popular franchises. Yes, Skyfall was really successful but that was in 2012 only two years after the proper start to the MCU and the industry has changed massively since then.

    But also If you compare casting news of a Bond film to a Marvel or DC film, the latter will always gather a bigger interest because its not just huge Marvel/DC fans, its the general public.

    So the Bond franchise needs to practise what it preaches and change with the times. ONCE AGAIN if a 00 agent quits in a modern-day world, specifically 2019/2020, the new replacement has an equal chance of being a man or a woman, and if when writing the script and considering changing the franchise, it makes sense that the new 007 would be a woman then bloody well do it and create some buzz and interesting character motivations and dynamics.

    If they wanna get people to watch, they can't keep doing the same stuff. Spectre was 2 hours of homage, so why not make the follow-up as original as possible.

    @Denbigh can't they think of anything creative then use politics to sell tickets no imagination like there are better ways like create a new secret agent to try to out duel Bond like the whole 009 thing from Spectre.
    I'm sorry to get all political myself but you can't just say a woman can't play this part because of "politics", because it's giving in to the SJW blah blah blah.

    That's like saying "You shouldn't make Black Panther because of politics. You're just making a black superhero film because you're just trying to introduce more black characters into film so that you can sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and culture in a film doesn't have to be considered politics.

    "Oh no this woman can't play a role that narratively any gender could play because that's just the effect of SJW's and people wanting a black/female James Bond. Again, using politics to sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and gender in a film doesn't have to be politics.

    How are we meant to progress and move forward if people don't make decisions that are going to help progress and move forward whether you like it or not.

    @Denbigh if you want progress change change all the genders of characters like and race and see how you much sense is left.

    That's not even an argument for what you're trying to say. You're just ridiculously hypothesising.

    James Bond without the codename is still James Bond.

    Nothing about him as a person changes when you remove his codename.

    @Denbigh you talked about black panther what if we made Black panther white oh that's not right is it I guess it is or let's make wonder women a man now men are relevant. Thanks for trying to trick me and change things up didn't work.

    You've actually done most of the work for him, to be honest.
  • Getafix wrote: »
    It also incontrovertibly puts to bed the codename theory. 007 is a number that can be assigned to anyone but James Bond is not a code name.
    That is the point!
    In my opinion, the idea is absolutely brillinat, a very good way to adapt the series to the feminist and multicultural era, keeping the esence of a white sexist hero.
  • Posts: 11,425
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Bond wrote: »
    vzok wrote: »
    Bond wrote: »
    Getafix wrote: »
    It also incontrovertibly puts to bed the codename theory. 007 is a number that can be assigned to anyone but James Bond is not a code name.
    Well technically all it does is decouple 007 from James Bond, it doesn't mean James Bond isn't still a codename. It's a pretty generic name after all, and you still have to account for how 6 different actors have portrayed the identically-named person spanning the 1960s to the 2020s.

    They are actors playing a part in a movie.

    So we just ignore the timeline issue? The Bond living in 1962 and surrounded by its signifying elements is the same person as the Bond living in 2020?

    Bond is the same character but in a different world. Look I'm for change but sometimes change goes too far for my liking and certain things need to stay the same or things fall apart.

    If you want to go down that road you can go back to LTK and Bond "going rogue" the first time.

    Cubby was quite clearly generally happy to keep on ploughing the same field endlessly. MGW had wanted to do an origins Bond and reboot since at least TLD. It's frankly not surprising Cubby's kids wanted to mess with the formula. Anyone else would as well.

    The Brosnan era was a creative dead end. I don't like a lot of what they've done with the Craig era but it's a lot better than the dreary sub-Moore parody we had between 95 and 02. Yes they could reinvent in a much more intelligent way but their desire to mix things up is very understandable.

  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    edited July 2019 Posts: 3,126
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Can we have a discussion page for the people who are excited about everything they're doing with Bond 25?

    The Bond25 echo chamber thread? ;)
    If that's what it takes. I'm all for alternative opinions but this beyond just an opinion. This has gotten to the point where people are presenting opinions as facts. People seemed to have already decided Nomi being 007 for a whoever much of the film will not work and is just a gimmick before they've even seen the film and seen the idea in context.

    Welcome to the world where everyone has different opinions. Whether you agree with them or not.
    I'm very used to it but when someone who compares the use of a black actress as the new 007 to a cheap, over-the-top stunt in a crappy James Bond film, that doesn't feel like an opinion, just more of an insult.

    There is much more that can go wrong with this movie than this. Waltz returning is more problematic for the franchise than this little codename change, which might not even be permanent by the end of the film. At least this piece of information got people interested and will probably get way more bums on seats, whereas Waltz returning generated hardly any buzz. People didn't really care.

    @Denbigh Because maybe that it is a gimmick people can have different opinions
    ...but what people aren't seeing is that in modern film industry, James Bond isn't as important to the general public.

    The film industry is a business so of course they're gonna make these kind of decisions, but is that unbelievable to think that the producers and writers worked in harmony to create something that felt good for the story and also appealing to audiences that may not have necessarily gone to see Bond 25 in the first place. The more successful this film is, the more Bond films they can make. Just because you're turned of by it, you're still gonna see the film and maybe others will to, and who knows you might enjoy the idea in context.

    I'm always up for people's opinions, but this stuff regarding the 007 codename being given to a black woman for ONE movie, is really not enough to write off the film already.

    @Denbigh aren't we the ones that fill their pockets and if it's not important why keep making movies sell the thing to Disney or Universal then.
    Because the things still make money and are important to a lot of people, but as the film industry changes, the Bond franchise interest levels with people has dropped and are not doing as well as more popular franchises. Yes, Skyfall was really successful but that was in 2012 only two years after the proper start to the MCU and the industry has changed massively since then.

    But also If you compare casting news of a Bond film to a Marvel or DC film, the latter will always gather a bigger interest because its not just huge Marvel/DC fans, its the general public.

    So the Bond franchise needs to practise what it preaches and change with the times. ONCE AGAIN if a 00 agent quits in a modern-day world, specifically 2019/2020, the new replacement has an equal chance of being a man or a woman, and if when writing the script and considering changing the franchise, it makes sense that the new 007 would be a woman then bloody well do it and create some buzz and interesting character motivations and dynamics.

    If they wanna get people to watch, they can't keep doing the same stuff. Spectre was 2 hours of homage, so why not make the follow-up as original as possible.

    @Denbigh can't they think of anything creative then use politics to sell tickets no imagination like there are better ways like create a new secret agent to try to out duel Bond like the whole 009 thing from Spectre.
    I'm sorry to get all political myself but you can't just say a woman can't play this part because of "politics", because it's giving in to the SJW blah blah blah.

    That's like saying "You shouldn't make Black Panther because of politics. You're just making a black superhero film because you're just trying to introduce more black characters into film so that you can sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and culture in a film doesn't have to be considered politics.

    "Oh no this woman can't play a role that narratively any gender could play because that's just the effect of SJW's and people wanting a black/female James Bond. Again, using politics to sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and gender in a film doesn't have to be politics.

    How are we meant to progress and move forward if people don't make decisions that are going to help progress and move forward whether you like it or not.

    @Denbigh if you want progress change change all the genders of characters like and race and see how you much sense is left.

    That's not even an argument for what you're trying to say. You're just ridiculously hypothesising.

    James Bond without the codename is still James Bond.

    Nothing about him as a person changes when you remove his codename.

    @Denbigh you talked about black panther what if we made Black panther white oh that's not right is it I guess it is or let's make wonder women a man now men are relevant. Thanks for trying to trick me and change things up didn't work.
    But that doesn't apply. This isn't changing the gender of well-known character. James Bond isn't going to be a black woman in this film. He's going to be a muscled, blonde man called Daniel Craig. Nomi is her own character and has just gotten a realistic promotion into an empty position, and I'm not trying to trick you, I'm just using evidence of other properties to show that not everything has to be a "bad idea with a political agenda".

    @Denbigh I know what you did and your cover up is to not bring it up pretty classic. ok so since you run the show we getting a new Bond logo 009 008 how we printing things or is Bond just out of the franchise and Naomi is the new agent how we go from here Ian Fleming doesn't matter too us anymore are taking his number and replacing him for the future of spy work. screw Bond we don't need him anymore. "This is the future because we said so and it makes sense."😉
  • RyanRyan Canada
    Posts: 692
    I don't see any agenda in this at all. We knew going in that Bond would be retired, or at least starting off the film that way. If we assume that he's been retired for five years then it's not at all unusual that his number should be reassigned. Despite the media running away with the whole "Lashana is the new 007" thing, I don't see it as pushing an agenda. With the right dialogue, it could be a great bit of fun. There's a major difference between being the new (or perhaps interim, depending on the outcome of the film) 007 and being the new James Bond. Clearly James Bond in the film is a white British male played by Daniel Craig. Lynch was fantastic in Captain Marvel and that was supposed to be a film with a huge agenda. Personally, I didn't feel that way about it all. I enjoyed it, and I don't usually do Marvel films.
  • Posts: 503
    Getafix wrote: »
    It also incontrovertibly puts to bed the codename theory. 007 is a number that can be assigned to anyone but James Bond is not a code name.
    That is the point!
    In my opinion, the idea is absolutely brillinat, a very good way to adapt the series to the feminist and multicultural era, keeping the esence of a white sexist hero.
    But what feminist, multicultural era wants to keep making movies about a "white sexist"? If they did, he definitely wouldn't be portrayed as the hero anymore, but the villain.

    Do you expect that future entries will star Lashana Lynch as Agent 007, NotJames Bond? Or that James Bond will continue to be the main character, but play second fiddle to other, more modern characters? Because you said yourself you think they are keeping the essence of him as a white sexist.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    Posts: 5,970
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    007Blofeld wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    Can we have a discussion page for the people who are excited about everything they're doing with Bond 25?

    The Bond25 echo chamber thread? ;)
    If that's what it takes. I'm all for alternative opinions but this beyond just an opinion. This has gotten to the point where people are presenting opinions as facts. People seemed to have already decided Nomi being 007 for a whoever much of the film will not work and is just a gimmick before they've even seen the film and seen the idea in context.

    Welcome to the world where everyone has different opinions. Whether you agree with them or not.
    I'm very used to it but when someone who compares the use of a black actress as the new 007 to a cheap, over-the-top stunt in a crappy James Bond film, that doesn't feel like an opinion, just more of an insult.

    There is much more that can go wrong with this movie than this. Waltz returning is more problematic for the franchise than this little codename change, which might not even be permanent by the end of the film. At least this piece of information got people interested and will probably get way more bums on seats, whereas Waltz returning generated hardly any buzz. People didn't really care.

    @Denbigh Because maybe that it is a gimmick people can have different opinions
    ...but what people aren't seeing is that in modern film industry, James Bond isn't as important to the general public.

    The film industry is a business so of course they're gonna make these kind of decisions, but is that unbelievable to think that the producers and writers worked in harmony to create something that felt good for the story and also appealing to audiences that may not have necessarily gone to see Bond 25 in the first place. The more successful this film is, the more Bond films they can make. Just because you're turned of by it, you're still gonna see the film and maybe others will to, and who knows you might enjoy the idea in context.

    I'm always up for people's opinions, but this stuff regarding the 007 codename being given to a black woman for ONE movie, is really not enough to write off the film already.

    @Denbigh aren't we the ones that fill their pockets and if it's not important why keep making movies sell the thing to Disney or Universal then.
    Because the things still make money and are important to a lot of people, but as the film industry changes, the Bond franchise interest levels with people has dropped and are not doing as well as more popular franchises. Yes, Skyfall was really successful but that was in 2012 only two years after the proper start to the MCU and the industry has changed massively since then.

    But also If you compare casting news of a Bond film to a Marvel or DC film, the latter will always gather a bigger interest because its not just huge Marvel/DC fans, its the general public.

    So the Bond franchise needs to practise what it preaches and change with the times. ONCE AGAIN if a 00 agent quits in a modern-day world, specifically 2019/2020, the new replacement has an equal chance of being a man or a woman, and if when writing the script and considering changing the franchise, it makes sense that the new 007 would be a woman then bloody well do it and create some buzz and interesting character motivations and dynamics.

    If they wanna get people to watch, they can't keep doing the same stuff. Spectre was 2 hours of homage, so why not make the follow-up as original as possible.

    @Denbigh can't they think of anything creative then use politics to sell tickets no imagination like there are better ways like create a new secret agent to try to out duel Bond like the whole 009 thing from Spectre.
    I'm sorry to get all political myself but you can't just say a woman can't play this part because of "politics", because it's giving in to the SJW blah blah blah.

    That's like saying "You shouldn't make Black Panther because of politics. You're just making a black superhero film because you're just trying to introduce more black characters into film so that you can sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and culture in a film doesn't have to be considered politics.

    "Oh no this woman can't play a role that narratively any gender could play because that's just the effect of SJW's and people wanting a black/female James Bond. Again, using politics to sell tickets." It's not politics, the inclusion of a different nationality and gender in a film doesn't have to be politics.

    How are we meant to progress and move forward if people don't make decisions that are going to help progress and move forward whether you like it or not.

    @Denbigh if you want progress change change all the genders of characters like and race and see how you much sense is left.

    That's not even an argument for what you're trying to say. You're just ridiculously hypothesising.

    James Bond without the codename is still James Bond.

    Nothing about him as a person changes when you remove his codename.

    @Denbigh you talked about black panther what if we made Black panther white oh that's not right is it I guess it is or let's make wonder women a man now men are relevant. Thanks for trying to trick me and change things up didn't work.
    But that doesn't apply. This isn't changing the gender of well-known character. James Bond isn't going to be a black woman in this film. He's going to be a muscled, blonde man called Daniel Craig. Nomi is her own character and has just gotten a realistic promotion into an empty position, and I'm not trying to trick you, I'm just using evidence of other properties to show that not everything has to be a "bad idea with a political agenda".

    @Denbigh I know what you did and your cover up is to not bring it up pretty classic. ok so since you run the show we getting a new Bond logo 009 008 how we printing things or is Bond just out of the franchise and Naomi is the new agent how we go from here Ian Fleming doesn't matter too us anymore are taking his number and replacing him for the future of spy work. screw Bond we don't need him anymore.😉

    Ok we're done now @007Blofeld because you're not even bothering to make realistic arguments :)
Sign In or Register to comment.