No Time to Die production thread

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  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,636
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    I wonder why Anthony Horowitz hasn't been asked to write a Bond film....maybe he's too expensive or something....or there might be other reasons.

    Does writing well for novels translate to writing well for film?

    It can. I always thought adapting his Forever and a Day novel would be a great start for the next James Bond. Time to bring in May Maxwell as well. Just keep Purvis and Wade away from it!
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,591
    Contraband wrote: »
    @Contraband These paparazzi shots of Craig aren't exactly fitting for this thread. Please refrain from posting these types of articles as they have no relation to NTTD production.
  • Posts: 11,425
    Univex wrote: »
    I adore that he didn't like Phoebe's rewriting of his work. Love it. My confidence on this film has increased by a considerable margin.

    Been saying we need better writers since...1999. Cringeworthy is the worth that comes to mind whenever we talk about P&W.

    Their method of writing Bond narratives is, IMO as a writer, ridiculous. I've heard and seen countless interviews with the pair, and their depiction of their so called method is frankly appalling. Reading science magazines to look for plot ideias is absurd. They have no grasp on the dynamics, organics, and overall narrative structure that these films need. And they just aren't clever enough for them. We need true wit, true smartness and inventiveness.

    I'll never relinquish on how much I abhor these two hacks, no matter how other fans paint their contributions.

    I sincerely hope they don't come back for Bond26. But I'm saying this since...well...2002.

    Same here. Something severely wrong at EON if these guys are rated so highly as their go to fall back team. There have to be better options out there. P&W's plots and dialogue stink.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    I think they mainly rely on P&W not for their abilities as a screenwriters but as guys who are familiar with Fleming’s works and can lay the foundation for a Bond film that other writers take over from and potentially improve on. That has always been the dynamic, and I think their concepts have always had a lot of potential that either lives up or never exceeds. I thought TWINE was a brilliant concept by P&W, but I blame the filmmakers/writers Bruce Feinstein, Dana Stevens, Michael Apted, and Babs and Mike for bungling it.

    I do think PW get a lot of undeserved flack by the Bond community, because there’s other filmmakers involved that deserve a lot more of the criticism. Heck, NONE of their work ever made it onto the final version QOS.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited February 2020 Posts: 16,417
    Contraband wrote: »
    More pics from Miles Nurnberger (Director of Design at Aston Martin Lagonda)

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    Great to see the interior of the ‘DB5’; love that big stunt handbrake!
    I wonder what they were all doing at Silverstone? Some kind of press thing? Hopefully a TV special or something.
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,585
    @Contraband Friend, please continue to share your Daniel Craig findings with us. DC thread here:

    https://www.mi6community.com/discussion/5539/the-daniel-craig-thread-discuss-his-life-his-career-his-bond-films/p134
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,417
    Must admit I don’t have strong feeling on Purvis & Wade either way really. When I compare the plots of say GoldenEye or Tomorrow Never Dies, they don’t seem hugely stronger or more interesting than P&W’s stuff to me; in fact the later stuff feels like it’s got more fresh ideas to me.
  • RemingtonRemington I'll do anything for a woman with a knife.
    Posts: 1,534
    I think they mainly rely on P&W not for their abilities as a screenwriters but as guys who are familiar with Fleming’s works and can lay the foundation for a Bond film that other writers take over from and potentially improve on. That has always been the dynamic, and I think their concepts have always had a lot of potential that either lives up or never exceeds. I thought TWINE was a brilliant concept by P&W, but I blame the filmmakers/writers Bruce Feinstein, Dana Stevens, Michael Apted, and Babs and Mike for bungling it.

    I do think PW get a lot of undeserved flack by the Bond community, because there’s other filmmakers involved that deserve a lot more of the criticism. Heck, NONE of their work ever made it onto the final version QOS.

    I've read that the opening car chase, Palio chase, and the opera sequence were all their ideas.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    Remington wrote: »
    I think they mainly rely on P&W not for their abilities as a screenwriters but as guys who are familiar with Fleming’s works and can lay the foundation for a Bond film that other writers take over from and potentially improve on. That has always been the dynamic, and I think their concepts have always had a lot of potential that either lives up or never exceeds. I thought TWINE was a brilliant concept by P&W, but I blame the filmmakers/writers Bruce Feinstein, Dana Stevens, Michael Apted, and Babs and Mike for bungling it.

    I do think PW get a lot of undeserved flack by the Bond community, because there’s other filmmakers involved that deserve a lot more of the criticism. Heck, NONE of their work ever made it onto the final version QOS.

    I've read that the opening car chase, Palio chase, and the opera sequence were all their ideas.

    Those and the general idea of Bond still being upset over Vesper’s death. But that’s about it, rough ideas rather than the extensive writing they had in films before and after.

    The impression I recall from interviews is that when Forster came in he practically threw away whatever draft was being worked on so he could start anew to put in his whole earth air water and fire motif with Haggis taking over writing just before the writers strike began. And when the strike ended thats when Joshua Zetumer was brought in to do uncredited writing.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    Heck, NONE of their work ever made it onto the final version QOS.

    Which is further proof that they're not the best Bond writers around.
  • ResurrectionResurrection Kolkata, India
    Posts: 2,541
    It's time for some new writers.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    Nobody has EVER claimed P&W are the best Bond writers. If EON actually believed that then they never would have brought in other writers to take over like Paul Haggis, John Logan, and Phoebe Waller-Bridge.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 4,247
    I think the ideal thing would be to get writers who are profound Bond fans....but yet still very clever in their approach....P&W are clearly Bond fans...and their Knowledge of Bond....meant they were like a safety Button....one could even argue that P&W know more Bond stuffs than Barbara & Michael....it's just like one of us here....going to write for Eon....the person knows Bond...but it doesn't make the person a super-talented writer....but Eon might just be happy to have the person around. But still having P&W on board helped the other creative writers, know things about Bond....Yes! P&W aren't the best writers....but these guys know Bond....and at times P&W felt more like Bond Consultants....than writers.
  • Nobody has EVER claimed P&W are the best Bond writers. If EON actually believed that then they never would have brought in other writers to take over like Paul Haggis, John Logan, and Phoebe Waller-Bridge.

    It is very common for extra writers to be brought in on film projects. Some screenwriters solely rewrite scripts.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    edited February 2020 Posts: 3,157
    Nobody has EVER claimed P&W are the best Bond writers. If EON actually believed that then they never would have brought in other writers to take over like Paul Haggis, John Logan, and Phoebe Waller-Bridge.

    Yeah, I know, it's just that your post seemed to make a point about P&B being competent and decent writers and then you ended that by saying that they didn't make QoS, which in my opinion is one of the best written Bonds.

    That said, I don't hate P&W and I disagree with @Univex (nothing personal, mate :D ) about this:
    Univex wrote: »
    Their method of writing Bond narratives is, IMO as a writer, ridiculous. I've heard and seen countless interviews with the pair, and their depiction of their so called method is frankly appalling. Reading science magazines to look for plot ideias is absurd.

    As a writer I can tell you that good ideas may come from anywhere, it's up to you crafting a good story out of it. Reading science magazines to look for a prompt is not a bad method at all in my opinion. And I like that P&W are Fleming experts, but I believe that better writers could be hired.

  • NicNacNicNac Administrator, Moderator
    Posts: 7,582
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    I think the ideal thing would be to get writers who are profound Bond fans....but yet still very clever in their approach....P&W are clearly Bond fans...and their Knowledge of Bond....meant they were like a safety Button....one could even argue that P&W know more Bond stuffs than Barbara & Michael....it's just like one of us here....going to write for Eon....the person knows Bond...but it doesn't make the person a super-talented writer....but Eon might just be happy to have the person around. But still having P&W on board helped the other creative writers, know things about Bond....Yes! P&W aren't the best writers....but these guys know Bond....and at times P&W felt more like Bond Consultants....than writers.

    Is there a reason you write your posts with.....spaces....It makes it surprisingly difficult to follow.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    edited February 2020 Posts: 4,247
    NicNac wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    I think the ideal thing would be to get writers who are profound Bond fans....but yet still very clever in their approach....P&W are clearly Bond fans...and their Knowledge of Bond....meant they were like a safety Button....one could even argue that P&W know more Bond stuffs than Barbara & Michael....it's just like one of us here....going to write for Eon....the person knows Bond...but it doesn't make the person a super-talented writer....but Eon might just be happy to have the person around. But still having P&W on board helped the other creative writers, know things about Bond....Yes! P&W aren't the best writers....but these guys know Bond....and at times P&W felt more like Bond Consultants....than writers.

    Is there a reason you write your posts with.....spaces....It makes it surprisingly difficult to follow.

    Nah, nothing special....I wouldn't write this way in real time. My thinking of writing with spaces, is it might help the reader....but I guess I have to minimize it then....to make it convenient for every reader. Coz actually some like spaces & some don't.
  • NicNacNicNac Administrator, Moderator
    Posts: 7,582
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    NicNac wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    I think the ideal thing would be to get writers who are profound Bond fans....but yet still very clever in their approach....P&W are clearly Bond fans...and their Knowledge of Bond....meant they were like a safety Button....one could even argue that P&W know more Bond stuffs than Barbara & Michael....it's just like one of us here....going to write for Eon....the person knows Bond...but it doesn't make the person a super-talented writer....but Eon might just be happy to have the person around. But still having P&W on board helped the other creative writers, know things about Bond....Yes! P&W aren't the best writers....but these guys know Bond....and at times P&W felt more like Bond Consultants....than writers.

    Is there a reason you write your posts with.....spaces....It makes it surprisingly difficult to follow.

    Nah, nothing special....I wouldn't write this way in real time. My thinking of writing with spaces, is it might help the reader....but I guess I have to minimize it then....to make it convenient for every reader. Coz actually some like spaces & some don't.

    I see. I think its just that some sentences that flow together like 'P&W are clearly Bond fans and their knowledge of Bond...' is broken up and threw me a little.

    No biggie, there's no right or wrong.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 4,247
    NicNac wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    NicNac wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    I think the ideal thing would be to get writers who are profound Bond fans....but yet still very clever in their approach....P&W are clearly Bond fans...and their Knowledge of Bond....meant they were like a safety Button....one could even argue that P&W know more Bond stuffs than Barbara & Michael....it's just like one of us here....going to write for Eon....the person knows Bond...but it doesn't make the person a super-talented writer....but Eon might just be happy to have the person around. But still having P&W on board helped the other creative writers, know things about Bond....Yes! P&W aren't the best writers....but these guys know Bond....and at times P&W felt more like Bond Consultants....than writers.

    Is there a reason you write your posts with.....spaces....It makes it surprisingly difficult to follow.

    Nah, nothing special....I wouldn't write this way in real time. My thinking of writing with spaces, is it might help the reader....but I guess I have to minimize it then....to make it convenient for every reader. Coz actually some like spaces & some don't.

    I see. I think its just that some sentences that flow together like 'P&W are clearly Bond fans and their knowledge of Bond...' is broken up and threw me a little.

    No biggie, there's no right or wrong.

    Oh, thanks....I'll make it 50/50 from here on out.
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    edited February 2020 Posts: 14,585
    The truth is that GadgetMan is the real Q, making Silva connect the dots. ;)
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    edited February 2020 Posts: 4,043
    Just watching SPECTRE for my first time in 3 years (for my sins) in prep for NTTD having pleasurably watched the previous 3.

    One of the biggest problems with SP is that P&W are the main proponents of the script and it is merely polishes from others.

    Some of the ideas are just utter rubbish, Bond getting an explosive watch when he's on indefinite suspension? Why would the head of an organisation turn up for a lackeys funeral?

    Also watching M and Bond antagonistic is cringe worthy, Bond and C is the same and Craig saying dialogue that would more common in a Roger Moore film.

    SF's plot holes aside there is anything as dumb as in here for my money.

    M's dialogue with C is just woeful, this is just awful, I'm sticking to this at 24 and I'm only at just after the White meet up and that was a huge let down, so much potential, making White have conscience, don't make me laugh.

    Add that to one of them being bitter about PWB's input, speaking out of turn, won't please BB, this should be the end of their time with Bond.

    Lets hope!
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 4,247
    QBranch wrote: »
    The truth is that GadgetMan is the real Q, making Silva connect the dots. ;)

    :D
  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 2,641
    Good points @Shardlake

    I do wonder what Wade didn't like about Waller Bridge's rewrites? Maybe some of the humour wasn't to his taste? Pure speculation on my part
    @peter would probably have an idea of what rewrites and that must be like
    Perhaps Wade is just protective over his work?
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    edited February 2020 Posts: 4,247
    There were rumours of a Blind Villian back then. I wonder if that was P&W's idea or from Boyle & Hodge or just the media at work.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    And another thing is that it’s not always the writers that come up with the ideas but certainly do from directors and producers. P&W didn’t come up with the invisible car, that was all Tamahori. They didn’t come up with Blofeld being a foster brother, that was Michael G. Wilson.
  • Posts: 380
    Walecs wrote: »
    Heck, NONE of their work ever made it onto the final version QOS.

    Which is further proof that they're not the best Bond writers around.

    Well, let’s be fair, even the legendary Robert Towne was rewritten by David Koepp on Mission Impossible. Screenwriters get rewritten and overridden by directors, actors, producers and other screenwriters.

    They’re not the best but they’re also far from the worst. They know the material. That’s what matters to EON. Everyone wants brilliance but, with something like Bond, having writers (at least initially) that understand intimate details of the world and characters is invaluable.

  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,636
    And another thing is that it’s not always the writers that come up with the ideas but certainly do from directors and producers. P&W didn’t come up with the invisible car, that was all Tamahori. They didn’t come up with Blofeld being a foster brother, that was Michael G. Wilson.

    Really, Michael G. Wilson was responsible for Blofeld being Bond’s brother? I believe you, but I would like a source please.
  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 2,641
    And another thing is that it’s not always the writers that come up with the ideas but certainly do from directors and producers. P&W didn’t come up with the invisible car, that was all Tamahori. They didn’t come up with Blofeld being a foster brother, that was Michael G. Wilson.

    I didn't know that. I wonder why MGW would suggest that. MGW seems to me a man I always thought really understand the character of Bond. Why would come up with such a poor story angle to tether Bond and Daniel's run in such an uninventive way.
    It Bond more weak and Blofeld less maniacal

    Most of Bond's enduring appeal is how little we know about him, and how we rarely chip away at who he is or what makes him tick, so when something minor is revealed about him it feels satisfying and rewarding for long term fans who have been loyal to the character
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    MaxCasino wrote: »
    And another thing is that it’s not always the writers that come up with the ideas but certainly do from directors and producers. P&W didn’t come up with the invisible car, that was all Tamahori. They didn’t come up with Blofeld being a foster brother, that was Michael G. Wilson.

    Really, Michael G. Wilson was responsible for Blofeld being Bond’s brother? I believe you, but I would like a source please.

    Not sure about believing you but yes a source would be nice, I heard you say this before and was surprised and it is the first time I've heard it before then.
  • ContrabandContraband Sweden
    Posts: 3,022
    jake24 wrote: »
    Contraband wrote: »
    @Contraband These paparazzi shots of Craig aren't exactly fitting for this thread. Please refrain from posting these types of articles as they have no relation to NTTD production.

    @jake24 Sure. No problem. But at the same time you could have referred to the D C-thread which I didn't knew about. Now I do thanks to @QBranch

    Even if I have posted lot's of NTTD-stuff I'm still rather new on the forum. Only active since last spring or so. Don't know all the threads for each and everything like you all do..
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