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Same here, although I'll say you likely have a finer appreciation for Serra's body of work than I do; I like the score in GE, and like Arnold's stuff as well, as you say.
"Avant garde"?? That seems to be stretching it a bit...
Me too, am a Huge fan of Serra and Arnold. In an Interview, Arnold said all Bond Composers should infuse Barry's Sound in their own original scores, but Arnold said Serra's score still has the Bond DNA even if he didn't use Barry's Sound.
Arnold using Barry's Sound, with frequent use of the Bond theme is because he's a Huge Bond fan. Sometimes, it feels as if Arnold can even take a Paycut to Compose a Bond Score. For example, if any of us in this forum were to compose an original song, or direct a short film or feature film or direct a music video or write a fictional Book, do a painting or drawing, write and design a comic book, or any form of art, one way or another, elements of James Bond would definitely be found in them.
I also think EON weren't ready for an Avant-Garde Bond score, because Bond didn't change then....Brosnan's Bond was still part of the Classic era. So Barry's stamp was still very much within the franchise. And Arnold knew that. Once we got to Craig's Bond, the sound started changing, although CR had a bit of the Brosnan sound still lingering here and there, even with CR's originality.
With QoS, Arnold went with a new Bond sound that still retains the Bond DNA with hints of Barry. I consider QoS to be the Avant-Garde Bond Score that won EON over. Coz after QoS, Eon were ready for a new Bond sound. EON might have fully embraced a Serra Bond Score today, since they accepted Newman's Bond. One could say Arnold paved the way for Newman. Back in 1997, Arnold's QoS Score wouldn't have worked and Back in 1995, EON weren't ready for a Serra or Newman-type Bond Score. Before EON parted ways with Romer, they were willing to accept any new Sound from any Composer, especially after Newman....maybe Romer's sound didn't have the Bond DNA at all, Thus Zimmer was called upon to save the day....In an interview, Arnold even said Zimmer creates impressive sounds.
Agreed either Barry or someone who can do their own thing. Although i do enjoy Arnold's score in DAD & QOS. Either let one composer do all the score for every era or bring someone new every film.
The modern recreation of what the 60s scores sounded like is exactly why I love TND’s score. You call it slavish and I see your point. But I see it as embracing an internationally recognisable ‘Bondian sound.’ I was also relieved after GE in all honesty.
My main criticism of Arnold is the drum and base he incorporated into his later scores, trying to be ‘cool/modern’ but really having no place in Bond in my opinion.
Agreed. Some of it was subtle and enhanced the mood and feel, rooting it firmly in the modern day. However, there were times when it was overused.
I couldn't agree more.
Yes, Tomorrow Never Dies and The World Is Not Enough sound like they were cut from the same cloth, IMO. I've always found Arnold grossly overrated and his best work to be that of Casino Royale and Quantum of Solace where he had to withhold from using the Bond theme, IMO. Outside of those soundtracks he overused the theme and didn't bring anything new or original to the table. I'd argue that Die Another Day is probably his best score from the Brosnan era, because at least he made an attempt at something new. I love the Bond theme as much as anyone, but it doesn't make my hairs stand on end when it's being used too often, whereas if it's used sparingly it makes the moment truly special - take the final scene of Casino Royale as a case in point.
I have always loved Serra's score and not only for nostalgia. The mix of synthesizers and drums is a perfect accompaniment to the Cold War tone of the film. I absolutely love Serra's take on the Bond theme in the entirety of the score, particularly in the GB sequence. The way in which Serra also adds sounds like the bells of snow dogs into particularly cues is inspired too.
I admire the fact that Serra succumb to "traditional" Bond sounds and followed his own vision of what he believed a Bond soundtrack should sound like. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery in the case of Arnold, but unfortunately his scores feel like poor mans Barry, IMO. Serra's score is what makes Goldeneye unique.
I've always wondered if he sampled the Goldfinger fanfare for it though? It always sounds very similar to my ear.
Yeah, Serra said Goldfinger is his favourite Bond film.
The percussion is a solid addition to the gunbarrel, indeed it is. I was astonished back in the '90s to discover that it wasn't on the soundtrack CD. Luckily, later attempts at expanding the soundtrack lifted it from the movie copy, cleaned it up to the best of their abilities and opened the "score" with it.
Yeah, I need that too....from La-La Land Records you mean?....I would also like one for Hamlisch's TSWLM as well.
Another exciting cue that I'd love to hear from Serra's score that has never been released is from the scene where Bond and Natalya are trapped in the Tiger helicopter.
There's an expanded edition of the score floating around out there. You can actually buy it on CD (as I did), so it's not an illegal download or something. It has this amazing track on it, albeit not entirely devoid of SFX, sadly. It's the best we can find right now, though. So yes, I too would very much like to see them remaster the scores you mention. I dream of a remastered MR score but alas, it has been explained to me countless times that no such thing will be possible given that the original recordings probably no longer exist.
The Gunbarrel riff is good, I agree.
Yeah LTK is a funny old album, all chopped up.
I enjoy it in the film but probably wouldn't buy a new CD of it though.
Yes that is a nice little cue. I'm trying to think of much else that is missing... I guess the sauna bit...? There's not much that isn't represented on the official CD is there?
Wasn't it supposed to be a limited edition in fact? Has anyone not got a gold CD? :D
One can still dream, @DarthDimi :)
I love Kamen's music in general so I'll be there day one if it ever happens. I bought the complete Lethal Weapon collection when it came out, too.
A lot of criticisms of his work on LTK seem to come from a line of thinking that the score is a bit too anonymous, but I think Kamen's style is instantly recognisable and it's very big, very ballsy and full of personality. His action writing is superb. It's like Bond music on steroids - which in itself is a summary of why people generally love it or dislike it, I always thought.
Haha! I still have mine, anyway. Still in good nick, too. It also has really nice liner photos.
As for what's missing; I'm not sure there's anything huge at this stage other than the cues mentioned above. The tank chase is really the only biggy. A lot of the rest of the score, especially stuff featured towards the end of the film, seems to be "film version" edits of themes that are present on the CD in one way or another.
Exactly. For now, I must say, I'm quite pleased with the beautiful (almost) full scores we have been given. :)
Yeah it's definitely very punchy exciting music, I do like it but there's not a lot of it I like to listen to outside the film. His arrangement of the Bond theme is pretty great and very original: he makes it his own. I don't just mean the latin guitar, but how he actually writes the sequences it features in.
Yeah, even if it's not exactly the cues in the film I think all of the main themes are covered on the CD. I guess the orchestral bit when the dish is destroyed is unlike most on the CD, but it's short and might possibly be Altman again..?
One cue I’d like is from the Severnaya sequence with Orumov and Xenia activating the Goldeneye. It’s mostly ambience but it’s very effective.
Isn't that more or less in the 'Fatal Weakness' track on the soundstrack?
Some of that was used, but I’m referring to the section that plays after Xenia shoots the control people and before they leave after activating it.
Okay yeah, I think I know what you're referring to. Indeed, that has yet to make it into any release I think.
You can't get better approval than from the master! Barry had great taste.
TND is everything a Bond score should be (especially for that film) its big, brassy and great fun 👍
Exactly.