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Controversial opinions about Bond films

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  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 3,996
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    Recently listened to all the Arnold Bond soundtracks. Controversially I think CR is his least convincing effort with “Miami International” as his worst piece for the Bond films. Equally controversially I rank his first, TND, only slightly above CR. In TND he’s mostly doing a Barry impression while in TWINE, DAD and QOS he finds his own sound and provides a succesful mix of orchestra and electronic cues.

    I’d rank the Arnold scores thusly:
    1. TWINE
    2. QOS
    3. DAD
    4. TND
    5. CR

    I think Arnold has been an incredibly consistent Bond Composer. He did say when composing TND he was coming to it as a 'Barry fan' and i think he succeeded brilliantly in capturing the 'Barry sound'

    I think he brings something different to all his scores. I find his music for CR beautiful and romantic while DAD is more energetic and loud.

    I think his action cues are second to none and 'White Knight' is one of the best pieces of music in the series.

    Wish he'd done GE
  • barryt007barryt007
    Posts: 19,339
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    Recently listened to all the Arnold Bond soundtracks. Controversially I think CR is his least convincing effort with “Miami International” as his worst piece for the Bond films. Equally controversially I rank his first, TND, only slightly above CR. In TND he’s mostly doing a Barry impression while in TWINE, DAD and QOS he finds his own sound and provides a succesful mix of orchestra and electronic cues.

    I’d rank the Arnold scores thusly:
    1. TWINE
    2. QOS
    3. DAD
    4. TND
    5. CR

    I think Arnold has been an incredibly consistent Bond Composer. He did say when composing TND he was coming to it as a 'Barry fan' and i think he succeeded brilliantly in capturing the 'Barry sound'

    I think he brings something different to all his scores. I find his music for CR beautiful and romantic while DAD is more energetic and loud.

    I think his action cues are second to none and 'White Knight' is one of the best pieces of music in the series.

    Wish he'd done GE

    That's why I would like him to come back for B25..totally agree with you Leonard.
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 3,996
    barryt007 wrote: »
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    Recently listened to all the Arnold Bond soundtracks. Controversially I think CR is his least convincing effort with “Miami International” as his worst piece for the Bond films. Equally controversially I rank his first, TND, only slightly above CR. In TND he’s mostly doing a Barry impression while in TWINE, DAD and QOS he finds his own sound and provides a succesful mix of orchestra and electronic cues.

    I’d rank the Arnold scores thusly:
    1. TWINE
    2. QOS
    3. DAD
    4. TND
    5. CR

    I think Arnold has been an incredibly consistent Bond Composer. He did say when composing TND he was coming to it as a 'Barry fan' and i think he succeeded brilliantly in capturing the 'Barry sound'

    I think he brings something different to all his scores. I find his music for CR beautiful and romantic while DAD is more energetic and loud.

    I think his action cues are second to none and 'White Knight' is one of the best pieces of music in the series.

    Wish he'd done GE

    That's why I would like him to come back for B25..totally agree with you Leonard.

    Thanks. Bond 25 needs him!!!!!
  • JamesBondKenyaJamesBondKenya Danny Boyle laughs to himself
    Posts: 2,730
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    barryt007 wrote: »
    LeonardPine wrote: »
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    Recently listened to all the Arnold Bond soundtracks. Controversially I think CR is his least convincing effort with “Miami International” as his worst piece for the Bond films. Equally controversially I rank his first, TND, only slightly above CR. In TND he’s mostly doing a Barry impression while in TWINE, DAD and QOS he finds his own sound and provides a succesful mix of orchestra and electronic cues.

    I’d rank the Arnold scores thusly:
    1. TWINE
    2. QOS
    3. DAD
    4. TND
    5. CR

    I think Arnold has been an incredibly consistent Bond Composer. He did say when composing TND he was coming to it as a 'Barry fan' and i think he succeeded brilliantly in capturing the 'Barry sound'

    I think he brings something different to all his scores. I find his music for CR beautiful and romantic while DAD is more energetic and loud.

    I think his action cues are second to none and 'White Knight' is one of the best pieces of music in the series.

    Wish he'd done GE

    That's why I would like him to come back for B25..totally agree with you Leonard.

    Thanks. Bond 25 needs him!!!!!

    A crime if they don’t get him back
  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 3,000
    This guy understands what makes a proper Bond movie: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/films/2017/11/21/nightfire-forgotten-video-game-could-save-james-bond-films-terminal/

    Although I’m not in favor of adapting Nightfire into a film, I agree with the article in spirit especially this quote: “If you have a character as great as Bond, why waste him on emotional deconstruction and not vicarious wish-fulfilment? Nightfire embraces a Bond at the top of his saving-the-world game, for whom “nobody does it better” means something.”
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    This guy understands what makes a proper Bond movie: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/films/2017/11/21/nightfire-forgotten-video-game-could-save-james-bond-films-terminal/

    Although I’m not in favor of adapting Nightfire into a film, I agree with the article in spirit especially this quote: “If you have a character as great as Bond, why waste him on emotional deconstruction and not vicarious wish-fulfilment? Nightfire embraces a Bond at the top of his saving-the-world game, for whom “nobody does it better” means something.”
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  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,568
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    This guy understands what makes a proper Bond movie: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/films/2017/11/21/nightfire-forgotten-video-game-could-save-james-bond-films-terminal/

    Although I’m not in favor of adapting Nightfire into a film, I agree with the article in spirit especially this quote: “If you have a character as great as Bond, why waste him on emotional deconstruction and not vicarious wish-fulfilment? Nightfire embraces a Bond at the top of his saving-the-world game, for whom “nobody does it better” means something.”
    I like it. It's inevitable we'll go back to those kind of adventures on the big screen. I have to ask, why you don't wish to see NF adapted? Is it because it's already a perfect standalone mission in game format and thus shouldn't be tampered with? I'm not saying I want it to - I see adapting the games different to adapting the novels, since the games are almost like films already, it would feel like retreading the same ground. Just curious on what others think.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    edited March 2019 Posts: 15,423
    As much as I find it tempting to adapt NF to the big screen, unfortunately it's one I wouldn't want to see it happening.

    1. There are chances its legacy is going to be ruined by awful rewriting.
    2. NF is a beautiful homage to YOLT, TSWLM and MR combined into one.
    3. NF without Brosnan's Bond is not NF to me at all!
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,568
    That's another good point - most of the games have an established Bond actor in the role, and therefore it is their baby. I think you could take some characters and locations from the JB007 Gameboy adventure, with Tibet, Zhong Mae etc., and adapt them successfully.
  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 3,000
    I’m not so much opposed to the idea of adapting NF into a film, but the main issues I have are that it would inevitably draw comparisons to MR, and that audiences would likely look down their noses at a Bond film based on a game. That said, we could do (and have done) a lot worse than Nightfire’s plot, and I’m sure it would be an immensely enjoyable film.
  • RoadphillRoadphill United Kingdom
    Posts: 984
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    This guy understands what makes a proper Bond movie: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/films/2017/11/21/nightfire-forgotten-video-game-could-save-james-bond-films-terminal/

    Although I’m not in favor of adapting Nightfire into a film, I agree with the article in spirit especially this quote: “If you have a character as great as Bond, why waste him on emotional deconstruction and not vicarious wish-fulfilment? Nightfire embraces a Bond at the top of his saving-the-world game, for whom “nobody does it better” means something.”

    This
  • RevelatorRevelator
    Posts: 2,917
    Video games have rarely translated into good movies though.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Revelator wrote: »
    Video games have rarely translated into good movies though.

    Very true. I can’t think of one.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,110
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Revelator wrote: »
    Video games have rarely translated into good movies though.

    Very true. I can’t think of one.

    Silent Hill is the only one I don’t consider to be awful.
  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 3,000
    Revelator wrote: »
    Video games have rarely translated into good movies though.

    Yes that’s one of the reasons I’m in support of the spirit of the article (that we need vicarious wish fulfillment and fantastical elements back) but not the actual idea of a Nightfire adaptation.
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,582
    Bioshock should have been a movie
  • mattjoesmattjoes Julie T. and the M.G.'s
    Posts: 7,021
    Revelator wrote: »
    Video games have rarely translated into good movies though.

    That said, I'm not sure there is something inherent in a video game that makes it a poor candidate for a film adaptation.

    ---
    ClarkDevlin wrote: »
    NF without Brosnan's Bond is not NF to me at all!

    I agree. Giving one actor's story to another actor is a bad idea.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    mattjoes wrote: »
    ClarkDevlin wrote: »
    NF without Brosnan's Bond is not NF to me at all!

    I agree. Giving one actor's story to another actor is a bad idea.
    GoldenEye's remake proved it. 007 Legends further confirmed it.
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,568
    Although I enjoyed GEWii to a degree, it was not cool to have Brozza's successor helm it. Kinda seemed like rubbing salt in the wounds.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    This guy understands what makes a proper Bond movie: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/films/2017/11/21/nightfire-forgotten-video-game-could-save-james-bond-films-terminal/

    Although I’m not in favor of adapting Nightfire into a film, I agree with the article in spirit especially this quote: “If you have a character as great as Bond, why waste him on emotional deconstruction and not vicarious wish-fulfilment? Nightfire embraces a Bond at the top of his saving-the-world game, for whom “nobody does it better” means something.”

    There’s a sweet spot between the tone he’s championing here and that of the Craig films. It’s where I presume they’ll go next.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Julie T. and the M.G.'s
    Posts: 7,021
    I prefer Mya's Everything or Nothing song to Another Way to Die, as a song and as a Bond song. With some orchestral elements added to it, it could've worked in a film. In fact, it could've been a lovely instrumental, as well (now I feel inspired to come up with one myself).
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    mattjoes wrote: »
    I prefer Mya's Everything or Nothing song to Another Way to Die, as a song and as a Bond song. With some orchestral elements added to it, it could've worked in a film. In fact, it could've been a lovely instrumental, as well (now I feel inspired to come up with one myself).
    The Jazz version of that song perfectly demonstrated that the piece has melody as opposed to the abominations that were DAD and AWTD.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,978
    NF is my favourite Bond game, but if it were turned into a film, I don't think I would like it as much. For starters, I don't ever want to see Bond in space again (once was bad enough).
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    An adventure and action in space with late 20th century setting was something people envisioned close to reality at the time, hence Moonraker happened in that vein. Nightfire was an homage to MR, and nothing beyond. Nowadays, that "reality" couldn't be farther from reality itself.
  • Mack_BolanMack_Bolan
    Posts: 377
    OHMSS is George Lazenby’s best Bond movie.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,617
    Mack_Bolan wrote: »
    OHMSS is George Lazenby’s best Bond movie.

    I agree. :)
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,111
    Mack_Bolan wrote: »
    OHMSS is George Lazenby’s best Bond movie.

    It's also his worst.
  • RevelatorRevelator
    Posts: 2,917
    Mack_Bolan wrote: »
    OHMSS is George Lazenby’s best Bond movie.

    True, though I hear the unmade Diamonds Are Forever could have been pretty good!
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,111
    Revelator wrote: »
    Mack_Bolan wrote: »
    OHMSS is George Lazenby’s best Bond movie.

    True, though I hear the unmade Diamonds Are Forever could have been pretty good!

    I'll repeat a controversial opinion I placed here before : a second Bond movie with Lazenby, either with the same approach and quality as OHMSS or as he DAF we've had, would have killed the franchise.
  • RevelatorRevelator
    edited April 2019 Posts: 2,917
    Ludovico wrote: »
    I'll repeat a controversial opinion I placed here before : a second Bond movie with Lazenby, either with the same approach and quality as OHMSS or as he DAF we've had, would have killed the franchise.

    I think there are too many variables involved to make a confident prediction. OHMSS's own promotion and reception were colored by Lazenby's departure from the role and estrangement from the producers. Had he stayed onboard and played ball, he would have received far more promotion and the film might have done even better at the box office (as many have noted, OHMSS was not a commercial or critical flop). All of that might have ensured that his second film would be received well. On the other hand, both Moore and Dalton's second films under-performed, despite their debuts having matched or surpassed the grosses of their predecessors' last films.
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