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Why so many Felixes?

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  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,187
    Wright is my favourite Felix. I regret that we got to see so little of him in QOS and none of him in SP.
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,125
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Wright is my favourite Felix. I regret that we got to see so little of him in QOS and none of him in SP.

    At least he's mentioned in SP and appears in three Bond films. He made the character more consistent and more present than ever before.
  • VenutiusVenutius Yorkshire
    edited August 2022 Posts: 3,152
    Didn't Leiter have a scene with M in an early SF draft? Something about the CIA withdrawing co-operation because she kept making mistakes? Felix apparently had a big role in some of the SP drafts, where Bond was undercover as husband and wife with a female CIA/Spectre double agent - but none of those were among the leaked scripts! Witholding swines...
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,136
    I included both non-EON Bond films in my latest Bondathon, and even though I like pretty much all of the EON Felixes, my absolute favourite at the end of the road has to be Bernie Casey.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,187
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    I included both non-EON Bond films in my latest Bondathon, and even though I like pretty much all of the EON Felixes, my absolute favourite at the end of the road has to be Bernie Casey.

    Casie is definitely one of the best things about NSNA, in my book. Not only was Casie a good choice for the role, but Felix stayed rather close to the mental picture I had drawn of him when reading the books.

    I guess John Terry is by far the weakest Felix. Not sure what they are going for. The actor himself refuses to even talk about the character, as I've experienced myself. (He got really pissed with me for persistently wanting to talk about his role as Felix when the entire Q&A was about Lost. He was also being a hypocrite since he had brought autographed pics of him as Felix for which he charged quite a bit of money. Hypocrite!) Anyway, the script of TLD, which I generally think of as really strong, had this one weakness: it should have found a way to move on without another spy giving Bond a few useful bits of information, or without lending him the extra pair of eyes. I get that the CIA is watching Whitacker. Makes perfect sense. But Dalton's Bond seemed to have everything under control. And Leiter brought very little to the game anyway. That little hello with Felix in the middle of the film is nothing but a wasted opportunity to show Dalton's Bond doing some remarkable spying.

    And that's the thing: some Felixes have been pretty useless and redundant overall. Linder's comes very close, Burton's definitely, and Terry's is the prime example.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 5,436
    I love the trope of Felix being set up as the enemy. Young did it first in DN with Lord with sunglasses and stalking Bond at the airport. Then Young did it again with van Nutter in TB. He looks a trifle suspicious during the casino scene wearing his sunglasses inside and then by the dancefloor during the night.

    TLD brought back the trope of Felix being set up as potentially an enemy with him going to the trouble of having the women lure him to the yacht by force.

    I think they should bring it back, it's a guilty pleasure for me! :-c
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,281
    thedove wrote: »
    I love the trope of Felix being set up as the enemy. Young did it first in DN with Lord with sunglasses and stalking Bond at the airport. Then Young did it again with van Nutter in TB. He looks a trifle suspicious during the casino scene wearing his sunglasses inside and then by the dancefloor during the night.

    TLD brought back the trope of Felix being set up as potentially an enemy with him going to the trouble of having the women lure him to the yacht by force.

    I think they should bring it back, it's a guilty pleasure for me! :-c

    That was something they could get away with only because of the "Musical Chairs" approach to the casting of Felix Leiter in the classic Bond films from DN to LTK. Once you cast the same actor in the role in consecutive films or in the same actor's Bond films that element of uncertainty about who the character is will be lost. That's been the new approach with the casting of Jeffrey Wright as Leiter in CR, QoS and NTTD and presumably it will continue should Leiter reappear in the next Bond actor's era.
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,125
    thedove wrote: »
    I love the trope of Felix being set up as the enemy. Young did it first in DN with Lord with sunglasses and stalking Bond at the airport. Then Young did it again with van Nutter in TB. He looks a trifle suspicious during the casino scene wearing his sunglasses inside and then by the dancefloor during the night.

    TLD brought back the trope of Felix being set up as potentially an enemy with him going to the trouble of having the women lure him to the yacht by force.

    I think they should bring it back, it's a guilty pleasure for me! :-c

    Yes I always liked that too. And I'm TLD, while it was maybe the weakest of Leiter appearance, I still think it was a fun way to reintroduce him.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,428
    Heh, it is a repeated idea isn't it? In TB Bond punches him in the stomach as soon as he sees him (which makes us think he's a baddie); in NSNA he throws what could be a bomb at 007 at the airport - as Dragonpol says, because we're never allowed to recognise him because of his changing face, they like to play around with making us think he's a baddie :)
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    James Garner would have been a great Felix in the Moore era.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,638
    Thunderfinger wrote: »
    James Garner would have been a great Felix in the Moore era.

    100% agree. In particular a faithful adaptation of LALD, with Peter Hunt directing.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    MaxCasino wrote: »
    Thunderfinger wrote: »
    James Garner would have been a great Felix in the Moore era.

    100% agree. In particular a faithful adaptation of LALD, with Peter Hunt directing.

    Sounds like a big improvement.
  • Agent_Zero_OneAgent_Zero_One Ireland
    Posts: 554
    I think Moore and Hedison worked well as is.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    Agent_Zero_One wrote: »
    I think Moore and Hedison worked well as is.

    Same. Which is too bad we never saw them together again.
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    edited September 2022 Posts: 3,789
    It should be in AVTAK, never got warmed up to Chuck Lee.

    Edit: The whole film was set in America, it's just Diamonds Are Forever 2.0 for me, he's Bond's contact in America, he's there every time Bond goes to US.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    I think the only reason they made the new CIA agent character Chuck Lee was so that they could make him a sacrificial lamb. Since they already made Tippett that, they didn’t need another sacrificial lamb IMO. Should have easily been Hedison returning especially since it was Moore’s last.
  • RevelatorRevelator
    edited September 2022 Posts: 2,918
    Yes, that's what I was thinking as well. Chuck was a nice guy but we didn't see him long enough to be affected by his death. It would have been so much better to have Hedison's Leiter return, though the filmmakers would have needed to devise reasons why he wasn't around to help Bond later on. But if he appeared at City Hall after the fire it would have prevented the entire Keystone Kops chase, so his presence is doubly missed.
  • ToTheRightToTheRight
    Posts: 16,170
    In one of the STARLOG issues, Roger Moore mentioned that there had been plans for Hedison to return as Felix in AVTAK, then the Chuck Lee character was written in.
    Thunderfinger wrote: »
    James Garner would have been a great Felix in the Moore era.

    Great choice!
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    I included both non-EON Bond films in my latest Bondathon, and even though I like pretty much all of the EON Felixes, my absolute favourite at the end of the road has to be Bernie Casey.

    Casey is probably my favorite Leiter these days, with Wright close behind.
    If I were to rank the Connery Leiters just based on chemistry with Sean it would be:

    1. Bernie Casey
    2. Norman Burton
    3. Jack Lord
    4. Cec Linder
    5. Rik Van Nutter

    Odd to maybe have Burton so high, but his rapport with Connery is spot on.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,136
    @ToTheRight I agree on Burton as well, he’s not high on the list of most fans, but I think he had good chemistry with Sean too.

    Just for fun I’ve made an attempt to rank our Felixes, according to my personal preference of course:

    1. Bernie Casey
    2. Jeffrey Wright
    3. David Hedison
    4. Norman Burton
    5. Rik Van Nutter
    6. Jack Lord
    7. John Terry
    8. Cec Linder

    I don’t think he’s ever been really badly cast though, I’m quite fond of our Felixes, even the lesser-liked ones like Terry or Van Nutter.
  • GerardGerard
    Posts: 5,996
    What, no love for Michael Pate, AKA Clarence Leiter ? The only british (well, the actor was australian, but you know what I'm saying) Leiter ?
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    MI6HQ wrote: »
    It should be in AVTAK, never got warmed up to Chuck Lee.

    Edit: The whole film was set in America, it's just Diamonds Are Forever 2.0 for me, he's Bond's contact in America, he's there every time Bond goes to US.

    Why not have Walken as Felix?
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    Posts: 3,789
    Thunderfinger wrote: »
    MI6HQ wrote: »
    It should be in AVTAK, never got warmed up to Chuck Lee.

    Edit: The whole film was set in America, it's just Diamonds Are Forever 2.0 for me, he's Bond's contact in America, he's there every time Bond goes to US.

    Why not have Walken as Felix?

    Good call, @Thunderfinger, he could pull it off.

    Then have David Bowie as Max Zorin.
  • ToTheRightToTheRight
    Posts: 16,170
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    @ToTheRight I agree on Burton as well, he’s not high on the list of most fans, but I think he had good chemistry with Sean too.

    Just for fun I’ve made an attempt to rank our Felixes, according to my personal preference of course:

    1. Bernie Casey
    2. Jeffrey Wright
    3. David Hedison
    4. Norman Burton
    5. Rik Van Nutter
    6. Jack Lord
    7. John Terry
    8. Cec Linder

    I don’t think he’s ever been really badly cast though, I’m quite fond of our Felixes, even the lesser-liked ones like Terry or Van Nutter.

    Great Ranking, @GoldenGun.
    I'll try.............

    1. Bernie Casey
    2. Jeffrey Wright
    3. David Hedison
    4. Norman Burton
    5. Jack Lord
    6. Michael Pate
    7. Cec Linder
    8. Rik Van Nutter
    9. John Terry
  • Agent_Zero_OneAgent_Zero_One Ireland
    Posts: 554
    Thunderfinger wrote: »
    MI6HQ wrote: »
    It should be in AVTAK, never got warmed up to Chuck Lee.

    Edit: The whole film was set in America, it's just Diamonds Are Forever 2.0 for me, he's Bond's contact in America, he's there every time Bond goes to US.

    Why not have Walken as Felix?
    I don't know how he'd fare with Moore as Bond. As a villain you can read interesting things into that age gap, as Felix it'd be stranger.
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,592
    Who could have pulled off Felix for Brosnans Bond? Still don't understand having Wade over a rebooted Felix character.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Julie T. and the M.G.'s
    Posts: 7,021
    I want the actor playing Felix to continue to change. How about an eighty year old woman next time?

    -Langley is concerned about your activities.
    -Felix, great to see you here! I see you brought me some cookies.
  • ToTheRightToTheRight
    Posts: 16,170
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Who could have pulled off Felix for Brosnans Bond? Still don't understand having Wade over a rebooted Felix character.

    I agree. More of a Sheriff Pepper for the 90's than a Leiter.
    Somebody like Dennis Quaid maybe? I always felt Richard Dean Anderson during his STARGATE years mightve been a good Leiter for Brosnan.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,638
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Who could have pulled off Felix for Brosnans Bond? Still don't understand having Wade over a rebooted Felix character.

    I agree. More of a Sheriff Pepper for the 90's than a Leiter.
    Somebody like Dennis Quaid maybe? I always felt Richard Dean Anderson during his STARGATE years mightve been a good Leiter for Brosnan.

    Believe it or not, I think Michael Madsen would have been great in GE. Then reprise the role for DAD. TND should have had Q in the Vietnam scenes.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,188
    Would have liked more Desmond, but I think they were consciously limiting his time on the films in the 90s so not to work him too much given his age. He was surprised that he was even asked back for GE because he was certain that he was done playing Q.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Who could have pulled off Felix for Brosnans Bond? Still don't understand having Wade over a rebooted Felix character.

    I agree. More of a Sheriff Pepper for the 90's than a Leiter.
    Somebody like Dennis Quaid maybe? I always felt Richard Dean Anderson during his STARGATE years mightve been a good Leiter for Brosnan.

    Why not? Robert Patrick or Gary Sinise would have worked as well.
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