The fanbase is becoming more bigoted and I don't know what to do anymore.

2

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  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,252
    mattjoes wrote: »
    The fanbase is becoming more bigoted and I don't know what to do anymore.
    What? You're worried about that? What a waste of time. Go get drunk, laid, read a book, build a bridge and, yes, watch a Bond film, no matter what other people think.

    I strongly endorse the "getting laid" part. And reading books. Yes, that too.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,331
    mattjoes wrote: »
    The fanbase is becoming more bigoted and I don't know what to do anymore.
    What? You're worried about that? What a waste of time. Go get drunk, laid, read a book, build a bridge and, yes, watch a Bond film, no matter what other people think.

    All at once? I'm not sure I can keep up with that...


    Anyway, @Tyler_Durrane , where you get your information from and what you read is, indeed, something you should consider these days.
    Platforms like Reddit and especially X have been altered the last few years. Their algorithms have been changed to seek and promote radical opinions. Those trigger reactions, which means interaction which means more time on their platform which means more income.
    Another party has been promoting radicalism on both sides: Russia, Iran, China and North Korea are all known to support extremes on both sides of the 'debate'. It's a way of destabalising democracies and thus gain power. See what happened in Moldova, Rmania and far more extreme Georgia this year. Don't be mistaken that the US or any other Western country is free of it. Far from it, the BLM movement has been financially supported by the Russians, as have far-right bloggers.

    So, if you dive into the 'woke' or 'anti-woke' discussion, you're actually helping forces that want to destroy liberal democracies. No matter if you're on one- or the other side of the debate. And funnily enough, when people sstart talking again, their opnions often aren't too different. Anti-woke people are often just concearned parents, woke people are afraid of the loss of freedom. And when they discuss the actual subjects, they often really understand eachother. Sadly, (social) media thrive by strong emotions, those sell.

    Take FOX news: they've often scolded 'mainstream media', whilst they're the biggest news outlet in the USA. So, who's the 'mainstream' one? Exactly. But Murdock and co are interested in extremes, rows, fighting, and will do anything to light a fire.

    If you take all that into account, you'll understand that places like X, YT,Reddit, etc. are just not the places where you should read comments. There are university buildings full of people in Moscow commenting like that to sow discord. If you want to talk Bond, this is definately the place to be. For other subjects, there are plenty of friendly places. (For boardgames: Boardgamegeek.com).
    And even political debate is sometimes done properly. You just have to find the places, and read up on the platform(s) you find interesting.
  • SeveSeve The island of Lemoy
    edited December 7 Posts: 440
    Almost every post or video on either Reddit or YouTube will have Bond fans screaming about "woke this" or "woke that." Its been so common ever since three years ago. They are known to become incredibly defensive when everytime you criticize the old movies, yet they don't mind hating on the Craig films.

    Hi Tyler, here's my two cents worth

    1) General algorithms search based on what is popular (i.e. what site or post has been getting the most attention from other users of the internet)

    While the Algorithms that have been assigned to consider you personally do so based on what sites or posts you have reacted to, or shown interest in, historically, which works in two ways

    a) If you react to posts, or visit sites, that you disagree with (i.e. those that "push your buttons"), then unfortunately you will receive more and more notification relating to similar posts and sites, even though those posts and sites upset you or make you angry, and even though those posts and sites may reflect only a tiny fringe fraction of society.

    (Unfortunately, in addtion, I've also noticed that, on a site like Facebook, this can also happen when your friends react to posts or sites that push their buttons, as these are often notified to me as well.)

    b) However, if you only react to sites and posts you agree with, then it will forward more and more of those, which is much better for your personal blood pressure levels, but can be just as misleading, as your own preferences may also reflect only a small part of society (not that I would know one way or the other in your specific case).

    Other than not using the internet, there seems to be no way to completely avoid this process, so all we can do is try to keep it in mind when interacting with the net.

    2) The internet and social media (and even traditional media to some extent) tend to amplify sqeaky wheels. The silent and or indifferent majority won't register.

    The internet and social media has decimated the revenue streams of traditional media (print, television, radio) Most journalists have lost their jobs and many of those that remain feel the pressure to sensationalise stories by employing misleading "clickbait" headlines in order to try and attract the most attention and keep their jobs.

    Again this is just the nature of modern media era we are living in, and it is left up to each individual to try and navigate through it

    To discount or crosscheck or weigh up each item of data for themselves

    "Welcome To The Jungle"
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited December 6 Posts: 16,592
    Wait… being anti-woke means someone is a bigot? That’s a newsflash.

    If they make a big song and dance of it, refer to themselves in those terms, go into battle in some culture war, then yes, 9 times of 10 they are.

    CommanderRoss' post above also makes a lot of salient points on the situation though.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,693
    Yes, this site is generally known for being respectful. Social media can be a powerful tool both for good and bad. On this site, I feel comfortable, as I know my comments can be treated with respect. Even if they aren't responded to as much as I like. However, even my non-Bond related comments are generally treated respectfully. As I've said time and again, us Bond fans are one of the luckiest fandoms in the world. We just don't like to rub people the wrong way, by saying we're the best. So this is a safe site for all, particularly Bond fans.
  • George_KaplanGeorge_Kaplan Being chauffeured by Tibbett
    edited December 17 Posts: 701
    [COMMENT DELETED]
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,825
    mattjoes wrote: »
    The fanbase is becoming more bigoted and I don't know what to do anymore.
    What? You're worried about that? What a waste of time. Go get drunk, laid, read a book, build a bridge and, yes, watch a Bond film, no matter what other people think.

    THIS!
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,231
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    mattjoes wrote: »
    The fanbase is becoming more bigoted and I don't know what to do anymore.
    What? You're worried about that? What a waste of time. Go get drunk, laid, read a book, build a bridge and, yes, watch a Bond film, no matter what other people think.

    I strongly endorse the "getting laid" part. And reading books. Yes, that too.

    I did four out of five of those things yesterday. It was a fine day and my bridge looks fantastic.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,825
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    mattjoes wrote: »
    The fanbase is becoming more bigoted and I don't know what to do anymore.
    What? You're worried about that? What a waste of time. Go get drunk, laid, read a book, build a bridge and, yes, watch a Bond film, no matter what other people think.

    I strongly endorse the "getting laid" part. And reading books. Yes, that too.

    I did four out of five of those things yesterday. It was a fine day and my bridge looks fantastic.

    Pics of the bridge please.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Pay more attention to your chef
    Posts: 7,057
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    mattjoes wrote: »
    The fanbase is becoming more bigoted and I don't know what to do anymore.
    What? You're worried about that? What a waste of time. Go get drunk, laid, read a book, build a bridge and, yes, watch a Bond film, no matter what other people think.

    I strongly endorse the "getting laid" part. And reading books. Yes, that too.

    Yes. A certain Indian book would help combine those two hobbies in a productive way.
  • Tyler_DurraneTyler_Durrane Anywhere City
    Posts: 11
    MaxCasino wrote: »
    Yes, this site is generally known for being respectful. Social media can be a powerful tool both for good and bad. On this site, I feel comfortable, as I know my comments can be treated with respect. Even if they aren't responded to as much as I like. However, even my non-Bond related comments are generally treated respectfully. As I've said time and again, us Bond fans are one of the luckiest fandoms in the world. We just don't like to rub people the wrong way, by saying we're the best. So this is a safe site for all, particularly Bond fans.

    That's good to hear! 😊😁
  • Posts: 2,025
    We must agree you're either a Bond fan or you're not. If you're not all in on all Bond films, the reality is you're not a Bond fan. You're one or the other. Just like you can't be a little bit pregnant.

    Dumb, right? That's how I feel about the absurdity of labels such as conservative and liberal, woke and anti-woke. Politically, I tend to lean left, but not far from center. There are some conservative issues I agree with. Does that mean I must give up my liberal credentials? Can I label myself something else? If I don't favor a Bond of color, am I a bigot? Anti-woke? I guess it depends on who's making the rules and whom I am talking to.

    The nasty underside of bigotry is not new. I got my first full taste of it when I began teaching in a small Oklahoma town in the early seventies. It was wrapped up nicely in Christian fundamentalism. Back then it was spread by word of mouth. Today it is a keystroke away. Like today's woke and anti-woke arguments, back then it was also either or. There was no in between or gray.

    I reject that. I always have. As I said, I don't like labels. Labels define me for the convenience of others. They are not an accurate indicator of who I am.

    I do agree this site does tend to be fairly low key, but there have been strident comments directed at some whose opinions don't agree with contemporary views. The intent is to categorize them. A lot like that woke, anti-woke debate.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,231
    chrisisall wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    mattjoes wrote: »
    The fanbase is becoming more bigoted and I don't know what to do anymore.
    What? You're worried about that? What a waste of time. Go get drunk, laid, read a book, build a bridge and, yes, watch a Bond film, no matter what other people think.

    I strongly endorse the "getting laid" part. And reading books. Yes, that too.

    I did four out of five of those things yesterday. It was a fine day and my bridge looks fantastic.

    Pics of the bridge please.

    JR_LS_7.jpg
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,674
    mattjoes wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    mattjoes wrote: »
    The fanbase is becoming more bigoted and I don't know what to do anymore.
    What? You're worried about that? What a waste of time. Go get drunk, laid, read a book, build a bridge and, yes, watch a Bond film, no matter what other people think.

    I strongly endorse the "getting laid" part. And reading books. Yes, that too.
    Yes. A certain Indian book would help combine those two hobbies in a productive way.
    That'll keep you in curry for a few minutes.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,207
    CrabKey wrote: »
    We must agree you're either a Bond fan or you're not. If you're not all in on all Bond films, the reality is you're not a Bond fan. You're one or the other. Just like you can't be a little bit pregnant.

    Dumb, right? That's how I feel about the absurdity of labels such as conservative and liberal, woke and anti-woke. Politically, I tend to lean left, but not far from center. There are some conservative issues I agree with. Does that mean I must give up my liberal credentials? Can I label myself something else? If I don't favor a Bond of color, am I a bigot? Anti-woke? I guess it depends on who's making the rules and whom I am talking to.

    The nasty underside of bigotry is not new. I got my first full taste of it when I began teaching in a small Oklahoma town in the early seventies. It was wrapped up nicely in Christian fundamentalism. Back then it was spread by word of mouth. Today it is a keystroke away. Like today's woke and anti-woke arguments, back then it was also either or. There was no in between or gray.

    I reject that. I always have. As I said, I don't like labels. Labels define me for the convenience of others. They are not an accurate indicator of who I am.

    I do agree this site does tend to be fairly low key, but there have been strident comments directed at some whose opinions don't agree with contemporary views. The intent is to categorize them. A lot like that woke, anti-woke debate.

    You make a valid point there about labels.

    Some people love labels. They give it to themselves so they'll feel better. They give it to others so they can say: "that person belongs to THAT group, which isn't mine, so that's a terrible person by definition."

    That's the kind of thinking that keeps people from getting along. It's been fed also by the media who get more clicks that way. Labels divide a society and prevent people to have constructive discussions and it prevents them from looking at issues from the other's point of view, so they'll never learn. Labels profess only one truth and it is prohibited to think otherwise and that's what feeds extremism.

    Having said that, I think the internet and social media algorythms don't help in that way at all. The mi6 boards are luckily a place where you can find a big majority of reasonable people, ergo it's also a safe place for said people.

    Now, I'll go and follow @mattjoes's advice and do a few of those things. It's way too early to drink though, so it'll be one of the other ones.

  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,252
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    CrabKey wrote: »
    We must agree you're either a Bond fan or you're not. If you're not all in on all Bond films, the reality is you're not a Bond fan. You're one or the other. Just like you can't be a little bit pregnant.

    Dumb, right? That's how I feel about the absurdity of labels such as conservative and liberal, woke and anti-woke. Politically, I tend to lean left, but not far from center. There are some conservative issues I agree with. Does that mean I must give up my liberal credentials? Can I label myself something else? If I don't favor a Bond of color, am I a bigot? Anti-woke? I guess it depends on who's making the rules and whom I am talking to.

    The nasty underside of bigotry is not new. I got my first full taste of it when I began teaching in a small Oklahoma town in the early seventies. It was wrapped up nicely in Christian fundamentalism. Back then it was spread by word of mouth. Today it is a keystroke away. Like today's woke and anti-woke arguments, back then it was also either or. There was no in between or gray.

    I reject that. I always have. As I said, I don't like labels. Labels define me for the convenience of others. They are not an accurate indicator of who I am.

    I do agree this site does tend to be fairly low key, but there have been strident comments directed at some whose opinions don't agree with contemporary views. The intent is to categorize them. A lot like that woke, anti-woke debate.

    You make a valid point there about labels.

    Some people love labels. They give it to themselves so they'll feel better. They give it to others so they can say: "that person belongs to THAT group, which isn't mine, so that's a terrible person by definition."

    That's the kind of thinking that keeps people from getting along. It's been fed also by the media who get more clicks that way. Labels divide a society and prevent people to have constructive discussions and it prevents them from looking at issues from the other's point of view, so they'll never learn. Labels profess only one truth and it is prohibited to think otherwise and that's what feeds extremism.

    Having said that, I think the internet and social media algorythms don't help in that way at all. The mi6 boards are luckily a place where you can find a big majority of reasonable people, ergo it's also a safe place for said people.

    Now, I'll go and follow @mattjoes's advice and do a few of those things. It's way too early to drink though, so it'll be one of the other ones.

    I love how, for several posts, we've been silently endorsing getting laid. ;-)

    @CrabKey makes many valid points. I'm not a big fan of the notion of a coloured Bond either, but I refuse to accept that as a reason for being called a racist. Or a bigot. Or whatever. I also prefer Bond straight -- does that make me anti-gay? No.

    And I've already given my thoughts on the "woke" thing. It's a word that has lost all meaning. It has become a politically charged battle cry, nothing more. I cannot be "woke" or "anti-woke" because these are the "RRRRRRR!" and "AAAAAARG!" of today's YouTube comment sections and (a)social media, empty words used to reaffirm the tribalism of "us" versus "them". One might as well fart in the middle of a conversation, as the rhetorical power is similar to yelling "woooooke!"
  • Posts: 1,446
    We live in a crazy world with people arguing about whether Mary was Jewish.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,252
    We live in a crazy world with people arguing about whether Mary was Jewish.

    Even crazier, we live in a world where Jews supposedly use lasers from space to set forests on fire. Rather than lock up the crazy people who make such outrageous claims, we vote them into Congress! Crazy world, indeed.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou, but I now hear a new dog barkin'
    Posts: 9,081
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    We live in a crazy world with people arguing about whether Mary was Jewish.

    Even crazier, we live in a world where Jews supposedly use lasers from space to set forests on fire. Rather than lock up the crazy people who make such outrageous claims, we vote them into Congress! Crazy world, indeed.

    Ooooh, @DarthDimi ... watch out for the mods...oh, wait...
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,331
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    I love how, for several posts, we've been silently endorsing getting laid. ;-)

    Silently? I wouldn't call that 'silently'.

    And I completely concur! Getting laid and building bridges.
    chrisisall wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    mattjoes wrote: »
    The fanbase is becoming more bigoted and I don't know what to do anymore.
    What? You're worried about that? What a waste of time. Go get drunk, laid, read a book, build a bridge and, yes, watch a Bond film, no matter what other people think.

    I strongly endorse the "getting laid" part. And reading books. Yes, that too.

    I did four out of five of those things yesterday. It was a fine day and my bridge looks fantastic.

    Pics of the bridge please.

    JR_LS_7.jpg

    Well done! You're on fire!
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou, but I now hear a new dog barkin'
    Posts: 9,081
    Looking at what seems to be your concept of "building bridges", I wonder what your notion of "getting laid" is ;) .
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,231
    j_w_pepper wrote: »
    Looking at what seems to be your concept of "building bridges", I wonder what your notion of "getting laid" is ;) .

    tmwtggelephantjw.png
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited December 9 Posts: 8,452
    The problem today is everyone wants to be the ostrich with its head in the sand, living in their own echo chamber. Its always been the case that the only way you can truly grow is by engaging with people with different opinions, because they don't have to tell you what they are right about to tell you what you are wrong about, and if all you do the moment you encounter such people is call them "bigots" or "woke" you're only doing harm to your own development in the long run. This is one of the ways I think we have regressed compared with previous generations, instead of seeing the humanity in others and reasoning with them as equals we are happy to call them "bigots" and place ourselves above our own peers. No one can consider themselves better than others while they engage in this charade. Just treat people with humanity and respect whether you agree with them or not, if not your a bad person no matter how intellectually superior you consider yourself to be.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Pay more attention to your chef
    Posts: 7,057
    j_w_pepper wrote: »
    Looking at what seems to be your concept of "building bridges", I wonder what your notion of "getting laid" is ;) .

    tmwtggelephantjw.png

    Are you the elephant or Jay Dubya?
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,231
    mattjoes wrote: »
    j_w_pepper wrote: »
    Looking at what seems to be your concept of "building bridges", I wonder what your notion of "getting laid" is ;) .

    tmwtggelephantjw.png

    Are you the elephant or Jay Dubya?

    That's a very personal question.
  • Posts: 6,021
    I've just thought of something watching that picture : JW Pepper said he was a democrat. So, seeing him having trouble with an elephant... I wonder if there might be a joke here everyone missed. Just an aside, now, back to the original conversation.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou, but I now hear a new dog barkin'
    Posts: 9,081
    Well, Maybelle asked him to buy her one of them cute little elephants - which is the symbolic animal of the Republican party (the Dems have a donkey). Which is why Jaydubya mentioned that they were Democrats (that's Southern Democrats, at the far right of the political spectrum, until about the Reagan era, when they all became conservative Republicans). I guess his later problems with the baby elephant are really just a continuation of that joke, and I'm sure that at least American viewers understood it quite well at the time.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    edited December 9 Posts: 6,377
    The problem today is everyone wants to be the ostrich with its head in the sand, living in their own echo chamber. Its always been the case that the only way you can truly grow is by engaging with people with different opinions, because they don't have to tell you what they are right about to tell you what you are wrong about, and if all you do the moment you encounter such people is call them "bigots" or "woke" you're only doing harm to your own development in the long run. This is one of the ways I think we have regressed compared with previous generations, instead of seeing the humanity in others and reasoning with them as equals we are happy to call them "bigots" and place ourselves above our own peers. No one can consider themselves better than others while they engage in this charade. Just treat people with humanity and respect whether you agree with them or not, if not your a bad person no matter how intellectually superior you consider yourself to be.

    There's no culturally accepted common enemy around which people coalesce like they did in World War II. So there is a lot of infighting in the US, UK, and elsewhere, exacerbated by social media and funded by bad state actors including Russia and China.

    In truth, there is a common enemy and that enemy is Putin. We are in another Cold War, but not everyone realizes it.

    Meanwhile, this happened today:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2024/12/09/business/media/rupert-lachlan-murdoch-family-trust.html
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,825
    echo wrote: »
    In truth, there is a common enemy and that enemy is Putin. We are in another Cold War, but not everyone realizes it.
    Yeah, now no one has to miss it anymore. It's baaaaaaack!
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,331
    echo wrote: »



    In truth, there is a common enemy and that enemy is Putin. We are in another Cold War, but not everyone realizes it.

    Considering my wife is Ukrainian, I wouldn't call it a 'cold war'.
    I do get the comparison though, as it seems there is no direct confrontation between east and west, but in the digital world, a lot of damage is done. And it might be very well that the DHL plane that crashed in Latvia was actually blown up, as the Russians have tried to do just that several times in Germany nd other countries. It seems though our media choose not to show what's really going on. There are far more terror attacks than are publicly knwon. Explosions in weapons factories in Germany, Czech republic, Poland. sabotage, blackmail, etc.
    And obviously buying lections or influencing them. It is hardly in the news here, but in Georgia tens of thousands are protesting every day.
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