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"You Can't Win..." - Goldeneye 25 Project is ceased by MGM

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  • BMW_with_missilesBMW_with_missiles All the usual refinements.
    Posts: 3,000
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    I never played BLOOD STONE, was that at least decent?

    It was really good actually. The story was a little convoluted but the game was solid.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    I played Legends up to LTK and it was a chore to play. It felt like an old arcade beat em up. Get to room, shoot room full of guards, go to next room and repeat until level is complete. I haven't played Blood Stone personally but I've heard it was the best of the Activision Bond games.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,978
    Bloodstone has the best driving missions of any Bond game, especially that last mission. it's just the on foot ones felt underwhelming. No crouch option?

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  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited August 2020 Posts: 16,383
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    IMO there hasn’t been a memorable Bond game since GE. It’s the only one to exceed “this was alright”, and even then it was just a FPS with Bond coating. If Bond games return in the future I’d like more stealth and less shoot em ups.

    I enjoyed the way they tried to make Everything Or Nothing and Bloodstone into actual sort of movie events, that was nice. But yeah, no incredibly good games in their own right: it needs a good rethink. Something cinematic along the lines of the Uncharted games is what it needs. Bloodstone was a solid attempt though, lots to enjoy.

    Or maybe they shouldn't try and emulate the movies? Would a 1950s Fleming Bond game work? I guess the problem is you have make it rather overblown to suit the needs of gameplay, and by then it may as well be from the world of the movies.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited August 2020 Posts: 16,383
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    Denbigh wrote: »
    I personally think they should cast their own video game James Bond actor, specifically for his voice I imagine, and then just make a bunch of video games with him. They don't need to tie to the films.

    Yeah I always wished, after the FRWL game, they'd done a 70s-set big crazy game and got Sir Roger to star in it. He'd have sounded practically the same and I like to think he'd have been up for it.
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    Repeating myself from the other thread:

    It always irritates me when a company pulls something like this, because they don’t have to. They’re just choosing to be a-holes. This was a harmless, free, fan project based on a 25 year old game that has been out of publication for nearly two decades. The developers weren’t going to make any money off of it. And we know that EON/MGN aren’t making any money off the Bond gaming license at the moment. This wouldn’t have competed against any of their Bond games, because they don’t make those anymore. There’s companies like SEGA that gladly allow fan games like Sonic: Utopia because they realize that it doesn’t hurt their ip at all to allow fans to be fans. SEGA even went so far as to hire fan developers to help them make a new official Sonic game, Sonic: Mania. Meanwhile MGM/Danjaq are over here gleefully taking a massive dump on their fans.

    They're perfectly within their rights to control their property. Not sure where there's any glee being shown.

    They’re within their rights, yes. But that doesn’t mean that they’re not being litigious.

    Yeah it does, because they're not taking legal action. The very opposite of litigious, in fact.
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    Something can be well within your rights to do and still be an indecent thing to do.

    Indecent? Yeah, okaaaay...

    I’m not sure in what world a lawyer issuing a cease and desist order isn’t a form of legal action, but okay.

    In the way the word 'litigious' literally refers to court action and lawsuits, of which nothing of the kind is happening here. Calling them litigious is 100% incorrect.
    They were 'kindly asked' not to continue.
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    And yes, treating your fans this way is indecent.

    Mad.

    What are you actually talking about, out of interest? What would be the decent way to act? What would you think the decent way to act would be if you were one of their licensees who had paid an awful lot of money to use the brand?

    Issuing a cease and desist is threatening to sue someone if they don’t stop doing what they’re currently doing. So threatening to sue someone if they don’t do what you want is somehow not litigious?

    They haven't sued them. Litigation is defined as the 'the act of bringing a process in a court of law'. You're wrong. Move on.
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    Licensees in the past had to pay to use the Bond brand because they were producing games for profit. If you’re going to make money off of Bond of course you’ll pay a license fee.

    There are many licensees beyond games manufacturers.
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    The decent way for a company to behave in this situation would be to allow a harmless, non-profit fan project to continue; the way good companies like SEGA and Valve do.

    It's also to do with managing the brand. They choose what it's aligned with and how: that's how you control a brand. This is a very professional-looking product and could create confusion. It's entirely up to them how they control their own property. It's not decided by fans whining because they want something nice.
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    They’ve even gone so far as to work with fans on their game projects. There’s a different, better, way for companies to behave that has been set forth SEGA, Valve, and a few others. Just because it’s not a model that most companies follow doesn’t mean that they can’t follow it. They choose not to, and they should be held to account for their anti-consumer behavior.

    Okay, well feel free to boycott all of their movies in future. That'll show them for not letting you have something they never agreed you could have in the first place.

    Or we could all just be grown-ups about it.

    Litigious is defined as “unreasonably prone to go to law to settle disputes” which would encompass both the act of suing, and threatening to sue. Quibbling over the difference between suing, and making it known that you will sue if the cease and desist order isn’t followed, is purely pedantic as both are anti-consumer practices.

    No. If you haven't entered into litigation, you're not litigious. Much like if I said I were thinking of riding a motorbike but then never did, it doesn't make me a motorcyclist.

    Anti-consumer? What are you talking about?
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    All those other licensees are also for profit, and therefore can be reasonably expected to pay a fee to make money off of Bond. This was a harmless non-profit project.

    Using the brand they've paid to use. Why is it suddenly you think it's up to you how someone decides how their property is used? Would you open a bandstand on your neighbour's front garden and then say 'hey, I'm not making a profit out this so I don't see what your problem is!'?
    BMW_with_missiles wrote: »
    And yes, it is about managing a brand, something that SEGA, Valve, and others do in a much more consumer friendly way. I’ve never said that this wasn’t in MGM’s rights to do. And I’ve never called for a boycott. It certainly is their right. It would also be their right to go on this site, on YouTube, and on other sites and copyright strike every bit of fan art, every fan script, every Bond compilation video and anything else that they could argue doesn’t fall under “fair use.” They don’t because they are at least that consumer friendly, which I applaud them for. But if they did, would we sit by and defend their right to do that, or would we call it an indecent way to treat your fans? MGM has been rather consumer friendly in many ways, but I contend that they could learn for other, more consumer friendly companies.

    They're totally free to do that, and they've done it before. This very site was one which was told to remove all 007 logos etc. because it ran script excerpts from Die Another Day before the film was released, and that understandably pissed them off enormously. If that's what your consumers do to your product then it seems reasonable to be wary of them, no? I wouldn't call it indecent (not least because that's a slightly bizarre term to use, filled with hyperbole: genuine question but is English your first language?) I would just respect their wishes. I'm sad the GE25 project isn't going ahead, but getting hot under the collar about it and demonising Danjaq is pointless.




    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    I remember when an older iteration of this forum would not allow avatar uploads as a way of preventing the use of EON copyright material uploaded, because MI6 once got in trouble over using copyrighted images or something. Things have obviously laxed over time. Still, nothing compared to making a full fledged video game using EON properties free for everyone to play.

    Of course the slightly ironic thing is that GoldenEye 64's success and the reason it was so celebrated a game almost had nothing at all to do with the James Bond IP at all: it became popular just because it was a damned good game (and it didn't even really replicate the experience of being James Bond all that well). So they may as well as have just made a Bond-free version of it anyway! :)
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,183
    And their follow up was Perfect Dark, a better game then all the post-GE games. Imagine if that were their TND!
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,383
    Yes I lost many hours to PD :)
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    edited August 2020 Posts: 7,120
    Murdock wrote: »
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    I would love to play GE Source, but does it have similar music as GE 25? Just wondering...

    Yes, Yannick did music for both.

    The music alone must make it worthwile.

    Anyway, I see we were discussing which Bond games we enjoyed since GE N64. I absolutely loved AUF, NF and FRWL. Thought EON, QOS and BS were pretty enjoyable as well. Haven't played either GE:R or 007L though.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    Murdock wrote: »
    Maybe Activision will announce 007 Legends 2 and insert Craig's Bond into 5 more Bond movies he wasn't in. =))

    :))

    And because there are no more Lazenby movies to pick, Casino Royale '67 will be chosen instead.

    For real though, I so wish EON commissioned a game which included all Craig movies. The 007 Legends idea was not bad but it was executed in the worst way. So far Spectre and NTTD got no tie-ins, whereas QoS and Skyfall were only half adapted into game form (yes, there was a Quantum of Solace videogame but it was mostly based on Casino Royale, a new game could feature Port-au-Prince and more missions in Bolivia; as for Skyfall, there's the casino, Silva's Island, London and Scotland to adapt since they were all missing from 007 Legends.).
    I still hope a LEGO James Bond game gets made at some point since one was in early stages at TT's.
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,588
    Walecs wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Maybe Activision will announce 007 Legends 2 and insert Craig's Bond into 5 more Bond movies he wasn't in. =))

    :))

    And because there are no more Lazenby movies to pick, Casino Royale '67 will be chosen instead.

    For real though, I so wish EON commissioned a game which included all Craig movies. The 007 Legends idea was not bad but it was executed in the worst way. So far Spectre and NTTD got no tie-ins, whereas QoS and Skyfall were only half adapted into game form (yes, there was a Quantum of Solace videogame but it was mostly based on Casino Royale, a new game could feature Port-au-Prince and more missions in Bolivia; as for Skyfall, there's the casino, Silva's Island, London and Scotland to adapt since they were all missing from 007 Legends.).
    I still hope a LEGO James Bond game gets made at some point since one was in early stages at TT's.

    I totally forgot about the QOS game. I do remember enjoying it, especially being able to recreate the Madagascar sequence.

    I've always craved the concept of taking one large sequence for each of the films and putting it into a game. If GE64 could have 20 playable levels with some sort of depth as well as Everything or Nothing having about the same amount of levels then I don't see why they can't try to retcon the 007 Legends abomination. How cool would it be to play through Scaramangas island and into the fun house or take part in the Afghan base raid from TLD.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    Posts: 5,970
    I actually have a bone to pick with the QOS game, I remember in a behind the scenes video somewhere that Gemma Arterton was being scanned for a 3D model... but Fields isn't in the game at all??
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,588
    Denbigh wrote: »
    I actually have a bone to pick with the QOS game, I remember in a behind the scenes video somewhere that Gemma Arterton was being scanned for a 3D model... but Fields isn't in the game at all??

    I remember my biggest pet peeve with QOS was Camilles rendering. They mixed up her outfits in the Bolivian cave and the Perla Las Dunas.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,120
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Walecs wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Maybe Activision will announce 007 Legends 2 and insert Craig's Bond into 5 more Bond movies he wasn't in. =))

    :))

    And because there are no more Lazenby movies to pick, Casino Royale '67 will be chosen instead.

    For real though, I so wish EON commissioned a game which included all Craig movies. The 007 Legends idea was not bad but it was executed in the worst way. So far Spectre and NTTD got no tie-ins, whereas QoS and Skyfall were only half adapted into game form (yes, there was a Quantum of Solace videogame but it was mostly based on Casino Royale, a new game could feature Port-au-Prince and more missions in Bolivia; as for Skyfall, there's the casino, Silva's Island, London and Scotland to adapt since they were all missing from 007 Legends.).
    I still hope a LEGO James Bond game gets made at some point since one was in early stages at TT's.

    I totally forgot about the QOS game. I do remember enjoying it, especially being able to recreate the Madagascar sequence.

    I've always craved the concept of taking one large sequence for each of the films and putting it into a game. If GE64 could have 20 playable levels with some sort of depth as well as Everything or Nothing having about the same amount of levels then I don't see why they can't try to retcon the 007 Legends abomination. How cool would it be to play through Scaramangas island and into the fun house or take part in the Afghan base raid from TLD.

    I always wanted that too. One mission per film. Sounds like the ultimate Bond Legacy experience.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    edited August 2020 Posts: 8,183
    That’s what happens when you rush a game to meet the release date of the film. It’s why EA opted to do original Bond games, while the games for GE, TND, and TWINE came out very late to MGM’s dismay. I would have been fine waiting for a full adaptation of CR and QOS coming out a year or two after the film.

    Legends sounded like a great concept for the 50th anniversary, they should have saved SF as it’s own game to come out a year later or so. I would hope a video game license deal will be made on time for the next actor, but that may never happen.
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,588
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    Last_Rat_Standing wrote: »
    Walecs wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Maybe Activision will announce 007 Legends 2 and insert Craig's Bond into 5 more Bond movies he wasn't in. =))

    :))

    And because there are no more Lazenby movies to pick, Casino Royale '67 will be chosen instead.

    For real though, I so wish EON commissioned a game which included all Craig movies. The 007 Legends idea was not bad but it was executed in the worst way. So far Spectre and NTTD got no tie-ins, whereas QoS and Skyfall were only half adapted into game form (yes, there was a Quantum of Solace videogame but it was mostly based on Casino Royale, a new game could feature Port-au-Prince and more missions in Bolivia; as for Skyfall, there's the casino, Silva's Island, London and Scotland to adapt since they were all missing from 007 Legends.).
    I still hope a LEGO James Bond game gets made at some point since one was in early stages at TT's.

    I totally forgot about the QOS game. I do remember enjoying it, especially being able to recreate the Madagascar sequence.

    I've always craved the concept of taking one large sequence for each of the films and putting it into a game. If GE64 could have 20 playable levels with some sort of depth as well as Everything or Nothing having about the same amount of levels then I don't see why they can't try to retcon the 007 Legends abomination. How cool would it be to play through Scaramangas island and into the fun house or take part in the Afghan base raid from TLD.

    I always wanted that too. One mission per film. Sounds like the ultimate Bond Legacy experience.

    That's what Legends should have been. They did a poor job with how the levels were played out. Same with GE Reloaded. I went in expecting an updated version of the N64 game. They totally went the other direction in terms of characters, linear plot and level designs
  • Risico007Risico007
    Posts: 9,846
    ok what would be one level per film I am curious

    if I had to pick

    1. Dr. No: Crab Key
    2. From Russia with love: Orient Express train
    3. Goldfinger: Car chase around Auric Enterprises
    4. Thunderball stealth mission around shrublands
    5. You Only live twice: volcano layer
    6. OHMSS stealth mission around Piz Gloria
    7. Diamonds are forever: Mustang Car Chase
    8. Live and let die: Boat Chase level
    9. The Man with the golden Gun: Scaramanga fun house boss battle
    10. The Spy Who Loved me: a good ski level reprsenting the opening PTS
    11. MoonRaker: Stealth level around Drax's estate
    12. For your eyes only Car Chase
    13. Octopussy: Train level
    14. A View to a Kill Stealth level around Zorin's oil refinery
    15. The living Daylights Snow Car Chase with the V8
    16. Licence to Kill: Stealth level on the Wave Krest (armed with only a knife it would be like Splinter cell)
    17. Goldeneye: Cradle
    18. Tomorrow Never Dies: Car Park Chase
    19. The World is not Enough: The thames boat chase
    20. Die another Day: The Fencing level would be cool
    21. Casino royale: Gambling mini level
    22. Quantum of Solace: Stealth level around the docks (was in the ps2 version but not the 360 version)
    23. Skyfall: Battle at Skyfall
    24. Spectre: hmm a the opening pts
    25. Not time to Die: Opening Car chase in Marta
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,588
    DN- Crab Key
    FRWL- Gypsy Camp
    GF- DB5 at Goldfinger Factory
    TB- Stealth mission at Palmyra
    YOLT- Volcano Lair
    OHMSS- Escape from Piz Gloria (Skis)
    DAF- Oil Rig or White Techtronics
    LALD- San Monique Climax
    TMWTGG- Island and Funhouse
    TSWLM- Liparus
    MR- Space Lair
    FYEO- Warehouse Raid
    OP- PTS with Plane flying
    AVTAK- Mine
    TLD- Afghan Base
    LTK- Cocaine Factory

    That's all i can think of since from here on had been done in game.
  • ResurrectionResurrection Kolkata, India
    Posts: 2,541
    Murdock wrote: »
    Agent007391 wrote: »
    Garry's Mod alone.
    Speaking of Garry's Mod, A fan made HD Pierce Brosnan remastered mod I helped work on has been released recently. We recreated most of his iconic outfits and threw in some new original ones. Here's a small taste on what's in the pack.

    https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2173680125

    qnJzFkF.png
    BFCsMiI.png
    2XfcOq0.png
    PCJK6P0.png





    Brilliant work.
  • mattjoesmattjoes Julie T. and the M.G.'s
    Posts: 7,021
    Yannick Zenhäusern is releasing an album with the GE25 music in 2021.



    Samples at 5:20 aprox. Exciting!
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